Sophielo
Proud Member
I can't even bring myself to think about the notion that Michael woke up and knew what was happening. It breaks my heart to even consider that might have happened
well its gonna come out in the prelim so thats what i ment interms of damage controlI don't know. It would be too stupid, I think.... It just brought more damage to the defense, instead of damage control. But if they indeed leaked it, I am glad Murray has such a defense team, it would make it easier for the prosecution.
His eyes were open before the medics arrived so either the evil b**tard Dr murray opened them or in fact MJ opened his eyes and then he stopped breathing.. If you read the report no medics were there when the bodyguard and children were in the room when MJ eyes were open..
IMO as he was given high dosage of propofol it is very unlikely that he would have woke up - propofol knocks a person out. If he was able to wake up then the dosage should have been low. I think the Dr. opened his eyes to check his pupil reflex.
yeah agree. read that on other boardsAnd that once they open and livor mortis starts to set in they becoem very difficult to close.
I know for sure I read somewhere that your eyes open after death. And that once they open and livor mortis starts to set in they becoem very difficult to close. And that even once they are closed they will still want to open and so the mortician has to glue them closed. Has anyone else heard of this?
I suspect MJs eyes were only slightly open most probably from when his pupils were checked after he was already gone. god I hate writing that.
The AP report on the story simply says according to Alvarez's statement Michael's 'eyes (were) open and there was no sign of life'. TMZ typically embellished this to his "eyes were WIDE open" - I've never seen a patient die with their eyes WIDE open but happy to be corrected on that. I don't think he ever woke up, therefore had no awareness of what was happening, after being given the propofol.
Vid of Gupta (CNN medic) showing how swiftly propofol acts in the OR and the monitoring that's needed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1GdGMOJw4c
I have had major surgery with Propofol including tubes down my throat, "breathing" being ventilated mechanically- if he truly died from Propofol intoxicating with Benzodiazepine effect acting as added "bonus"- there is NO WAY he woke inbetween.
Respiratory Depression would set in after your unconscious- and according to the Coroner's Report Propofol levels were SO high that the Propofol was literally seeping from his eyes. There is no way that he was conscious with these levels. It wouldn't even be logical for him to be conscious trying to breath.
That stuff knocks you out FAST, I remember being knocked out with it.
I remember it too. There's no way, so please don't all be torturing yourself with that thought.
poor Katherine. I agree, I think it's murder two.
yet, T-Mez still thinks they won't upgrade the charges...
I don't care what mez is saying right now. I respect him and thank for defending Michael in the past for those lies.
But now, it's a whole other thing.
All Michael's fans, his family, and even his mother believe the charges should be murder. And now Katherine is DEMANDING. Michael's mother always knew what was best for him, including his justice.
Realistically I cannot see any more charges being filed but they sure as hell should be.
I should note this was posted in the gossip section if the new york daily news but I do believe the family wants the charged increased because they've made it known. Also I'm sure this is information the family has been aware of.Katherine Jackson demands upgraded charge of second degree murder against son's doctor Conrad Murray
LOS ANGELES - Michael Jackson's mom is furious over new allegations that her son's doctor was more worried about hiding the drugs he was giving the King of Pop than saving his life.
Katherine Jackson, 79, is demanding an upgraded charge of second degree murder, her lawyer told the Daily News, after a report claiming Dr. Conrad Murray interrupted CPR to conceal drug evidence from paramedics.
"Mrs. Jackson never doubted that this man murdered her son, and these new revelations, if true, mean we need additional charges to fit the severity of his crimes," attorney Adam Streisand said.
"Second degree murder requires malice aforethought, which can be implied by the conduct of the defendant," he said yesterday. "The actions alleged suggest that Dr. Murray abandoned his duties as a physician or an ordinary human being to save himself rather than his patient."
http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2...e_of_second_degree_murder_against_sons_d.html
When Katherine is not only speaking, but demanding, then YES, something really must be done.
It's just like Firpo Carr said, "Instead of dialing 911, he should've dialed M for murder."
As far as I know it is opposite. It is hard to open eyes if the person is dead already. But when the person dies with open eyes, it is very easy to close them. Usually when doctors or investigators look at corps with close eyes, they open them; then look with the light inside and at this point this procedure usually needs an effort to hold an eye open. Once someone removes hand, the eye of a dead person closes itself. This is the nature of death. If the eyes were WIDE open it means that he died with open eyes imo which does not make sense if he was under Propofol. The question is was Propofol given to him without knowing it and the shot woke him up?
IV was attached to his leg which is strange too.
As far as I know it is opposite. It is hard to open eyes if the person is dead already. But when the person dies with open eyes, it is very easy to close them. Usually when doctors or investigators look at corps with close eyes, they open them; then look with the light inside and at this point this procedure usually needs an effort to hold an eye open. Once someone removes hand, the eye of a dead person closes itself. This is the nature of death. If the eyes were WIDE open it means that he died with open eyes imo which does not make sense if he was under Propofol. The question is was Propofol given to him without knowing it and the shot woke him up?
IV was attached to his leg which is strange too.
That may just be the media sensationalizing things again, Murray probably checked his pupils and his eye's remained slightly open. But once one media outlet prints something, the others usually print the same thing, so I wouldn't think too much into that aspect of things.
Sorry just read this,that's the explanation I got as well.They said after death the eyes have a tendency to open some and that is why they are often glued shut by morticians.