My thoughts on Living With Michael Jackson

Giving "hero" status to abusive parents is a sad thing indeed. If you are interested in Michael Jackson, his relationship with his father and his philosophy on children, read his speech that he presented at Oxford University - that says it all.

http://www.allmichaeljackson.com/speeches/oxforduni01.html

Michael Jackson has a highly developed philosophy in regards to children and it is one that I support wholeheartedly. He has single handedly given more to sick, orphaned, handicapped and poor children than any other public figure. Imagine if just one major political figure, like a President or Prime Minister, had this love and generosity to children - the adults of the future - this world could change completely in one generation!

It is long past the time to cling to old ways and destructive behavior while claiming it is "part of our culture". African-Americans are not immune from evolving to a higher state of living and being.
 
You use the same argument as the people who condemn the jewish people for crucifying Christ. You need to move on, and stop condeming the man for doing what he only knew how to do. The fact of the matter is that the whole neighbourhood and a whole generation of children was getting whipped. It was considered the right thing to do. Even Royal children were getting whipped. So Why are you singling out Joe Jackson. it didn't do anything to YOU, Let Michael deal with his father, as he has already done. Stop blowing hings out of proportion, it is nopt fair to Joe jackson and to all the fathers who ever whipped their chilod. Kathrine Jackson did as much as Joe did too. And they were following the bible. 'Spear not the rod and spoil the child'.
He did what he thought was right. He did not do it out of malice. he loved his children and still do. Yes, he is a hero in the black community, We credit hoim for taking his children out of Gary and helping them to achieve the american dream.
 
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so what if it was considered the right thing to do by the society ? doesnt make it right
beating ur child is WRONG. plain and simple. i dont care if the whole world states otherwise.
heck, the society states its wrong to share ur bed with children that are not related to u.
to me thats crazy cuz to me and to michael obviously, its a very right thing to do. sweet and beautiful.
 
so what if it was considered the right thing to do by the society ? doesnt make it right
beating ur child is WRONG. plain and simple. i dont care if the whole world states otherwise.
heck, the society states its wrong to share ur bed with children that are not related to u.
to me thats crazy cuz to me and to michael obviously, its a very right thing to do. sweet and beautiful.
It was't wrong then Roxanne. In hindsight we look back on a lot of things that we do and we do it differently. At that time everybody thought it was right. So everybody did it. They quoted the bible to convince them that it was right. Homosexuality was considered wrong and people went to prison for it. Now people have changed their minds and now we make laws tp protect them. Buit we do not accuse the law makers of the time with cruelty. We just see it as a different tome and we move on, My argument is that Joe Jackson should not be singled out for something that was universally practiced and considered the right thing to do. That is grossly unfair to joe jackson and the Jackson family cause it is their family and Michachael father that is constantly being abused by his fans,That is not fair.
If you are against beating a child that is fine. I am against it too, but I will never single out Joe jackson and villify him and make him out to be a demon for something that was common practice at the time. I know scores of parents who beat their kids. Yhey are not evil people. They just do what they believe is right. It is still not illegal by the way. MJ's friend Liz Taylor wanted MJ to spank his children too, she spanked hers apparently. Is she evil too, or is it Joe Jackson we love to hate.
 
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It was't wrong then Roxanne. In hindsight we look back on a lot of things that we do and we do it differently. At that time everybody thought it was right. So everybody did it. They quoted the bible to convince them that it was right. Homosexuality was considered wrong and people went to prison for it. Now people have changed their minds and now we make laws tp protect them. Buit we do not accuse the law makers of the time with cruelty. We just see it as a different tome and we move on, My argument is that Joe Jackson should not be singled out for something that was universally practiced and considered the right thing to do. That is grossly unfair to joe jackson and the Jackson family cause it is their family and Michachael father that is constantly being abused by his fans,That is not fair.
If you are against beating a child that is fine. I am against it too, but I will never single out Joe jackson and villify him and make him out to be a demon for something that was common practice at the time. I know scores of parents who beat their kids. Yhey are not evil people. They just do what they believe is right. It is still not illegal by the way. MJ's friend Liz Taylor wanted MJ to spank his children too, she spanked hers apparently. Is she evil too, or is it Joe Jackson we love to hate.

i agree that joseph should not be singled out and i agree that he did what he thought it was right for his kids. the point though is that beating children and women is WRONG WRONG WRONG.
i dont care whether its acceptable by some societies and goes unpunished by the law.
i dont care what the law has to say about this. i know as a human being and using my common sense that beating someone weaker than u is WRONG. i have never made him out to be a demon. i think hes a very nice person actually who always cared deeply about his family.
as for elizabeth i highly doubt she'd ever beat her kids as she had an abusive father and she said in the oprah interview in 1993 how she feels and understands michael cuz she had an abusive father too and it was horrible. see, doesnt matter whether sth is legal or illegal. what matters is whether sth is right or wrong.
 
Giving "hero" status to abusive parents is a sad thing indeed. If you are interested in Michael Jackson, his relationship with his father and his philosophy on children, read his speech that he presented at Oxford University - that says it all.

http://www.allmichaeljackson.com/speeches/oxforduni01.html

Michael Jackson has a highly developed philosophy in regards to children and it is one that I support wholeheartedly. He has single handedly given more to sick, orphaned, handicapped and poor children than any other public figure. Imagine if just one major political figure, like a President or Prime Minister, had this love and generosity to children - the adults of the future - this world could change completely in one generation!

It is long past the time to cling to old ways and destructive behavior while claiming it is "part of our culture". African-Americans are not immune from evolving to a higher state of living and being.

I agree with you 100%. It does nothing to beat someone who is uable to defend themselves and it just makes the child resentful and afraid of you. In my view, it confuses the child, because the parent is supposed to be the gaurdien and protector, not the person you fear. It hurt Michael on an emotional level, that much I know, he wears it on his sleeve and its obvious when he speaks about it. Joe only did what he knew how. But Michael did better by breaking the cycle. And while we shouldn't demonize Joe, we shouldn't lambast Michael for feeling the way he does. Michael is afraid to even say anything which could be viewed as negative about his father these days, because people have constantly badgered him about being wrong to complain, telling him he didn't have it that bad, etc... But things affect people in different ways, and Michael was sensative to the treatement he recieved from Joseph and how that impacted him should be respected as well. I feel for Michael. I really do. He forgave his father, but his father never admited to making any mistakes, and that's probably the hardest part.
 
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i agree that joseph should not be singled out and i agree that he did what he thought it was right for his kids. the point though is that beating children and women is WRONG WRONG WRONG.
i dont care whether its acceptable by some societies and goes unpunished by the law.
i dont care what the law has to say about this. i know as a human being and using my common sense that beating someone weaker than u is WRONG. i have never made him out to be a demon. i think hes a very nice person actually who always cared deeply about his family.
as for elizabeth i highly doubt she'd ever beat her kids as she had an abusive father and she said in the oprah interview in 1993 how she feels and understands michael cuz she had an abusive father too and it was horrible. see, doesnt matter whether sth is legal or illegal. what matters is whether sth is right or wrong.
Roxanne, I agree that beating children is wrong too. I was one of the forst to go against it. Any member of my family will vouch for that. But it is about a belief system. There are those who will ague for it and those who will argue againstr. I argue against it, but I will not condemn and demonise those who argue for it. The bible does argue for it and many churcvh goers who follow the bible will argue for it. I do not demonise them for their belief.
Recently, here in britain there was a vote in Parliament about the issue to ban corporal punisnment, Parliament voted to keep it, even though they wanted it regulated. The Prime Minister admitted to beating his kids occasionally. This is not just a Joe Jackson affair, I am glad you saw the good in Joe. I am fed up of people villifying him and calling him names because he whipped his children.
Antoinette was exaggerating when she talked about MJ getting beaten late into his twenties while he still lived at home. That was so unjust and unfair. Why would Joe be hitting MJ when he was a man? Joe is not a monster, if he were MJ wouldn't have said that 'He is very much like his father'
 
Roxanne, I agree that beating children is wrong too. I was one of the forst to go against it. Any member of my family will vouch for that. But it is about a belief system. There are those who will ague for it and those who will argue againstr. I argue against it, but I will not condemn and demonise those who argue for it. The bible does argue for it and many churcvh goers who follow the bible will argue for it. I do not demonise them for their belief.
Recently, here in britain there was a vote in Parliament about the issue to ban corporal punisnment, Parliament voted to keep it, even though they wanted it regulated. The Prime Minister admitted to beating his kids occasionally. This is not just a Joe Jackson affair, I am glad you saw the good in Joe. I am fed up of people villifying him and calling him names because he whipped his children.
Antoinette was exaggerating when she talked about MJ getting beaten late into his twenties while he still lived at home. That was so unjust and unfair. Why would Joe be hitting MJ when he was a man? Joe is not a monster, if he were MJ wouldn't have said that 'He is very much like his father'

i give joe lots of credits when it comes to how strong michael is. yes thats a very good point. michael was taught by his father how to fight and how to be a warrior. hats off to joseph for making michael so strong and a true warrior. :)
 
i give joe lots of credits when it comes to how strong michael is. yes thats a very good point. michael was taught by his father how to fight and how to be a warrior. hats off to joseph for making michael so strong and a true warrior. :)
Thank you Roxanne. And when you weigh it all up, I always say that if God was hating on Joe he would never have blessed him with such talented children,I believe that it took a strong man like joe to turn out such a successful set of children. He had faults. He cheated on his wife, He was like a sargeant major when it came to descipline, but he was there for his children and he taught them to be the best and that no star was too high to reach, and that second was losing. he was also a dreamer. I see so many qualities in MJ that came directly from Joe. If we like MJ's ways, much of it came from Joe. MJ is a desciplinarian too. His chidren are said to be very well behaved and mannersable. He got that from his parents, including Joe. The man was not all bad. he just was very strict, and he believed in corporal punishment and he used it.:)
 
I'd like to know if you have any good adress where i can download the Take Two special that aired a few weeks after LWMJ aired???

Anybody??
 
This guy Nickboi42 is the only one who has the posted on YouTube. I'm sure you can embed them at least or download them into imovie or something. It is the complete collection, so give it a try!
 
Geez, what are yall fussing about.....Joe Jackson again?

Shoot, I got my butt whipped when I was little and I turned out ok.

I really think this issue is a matter of individual beliefs/religion, etc.

No side is totally right.

I, personally, will not whip my children. But I will punished them, "time out" them and/or remove privileges.

Michael loves and respects his father. The media makes me mad when they are constantly trying to get him to say something bad about his father.
 
Yeah, and just the same, a lot of kids who get beat by their parent's don't turn out okay. Beating your child will never make them behave well, at least, not for the right reasons. A child should be taught good behavior through example, not forced in to it for fear of being physically attacked. If a child turns out alright, it will be in SPITE of the beatings, not because of them. A parent's role is to protect their child. It only confuses them and, as Michael once said, makes them unable to relate to their parent's, when that person(s) is seen as the attacker, not the protector. Why do you think Michael said he doesn't know or understand his father? Michael loves him and Joe is a good person. But it was a mistake for him to beat his kids, and it didn't help any of them in the long run. I think Michael has a lot of emotional issues which were born out of Joe's treatment of him and that much is obvious from what Michael has said over the years pertaining to himself and his dad. Joe can't admit that he made mistakes and that's the only issue I have with him. You can't really forgive anybody if they refuse to say they're sorry or admit that they made a mistake. That means they can't accept your forgiveness and so both parties suffer from it.

I've seen plenty of other people who relate to Michael in that they too felt fear and resentment towards their parent's for beating them as children. Two famous boxers, Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Roy Jones Jr. are examples of famous people who have a similar situation to Michael's.
 
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Giving "hero" status to abusive parents is a sad thing indeed. If you are interested in Michael Jackson, his relationship with his father and his philosophy on children, read his speech that he presented at Oxford University - that says it all.

http://www.allmichaeljackson.com/speeches/oxforduni01.html

Michael Jackson has a highly developed philosophy in regards to children and it is one that I support wholeheartedly. He has single handedly given more to sick, orphaned, handicapped and poor children than any other public figure. Imagine if just one major political figure, like a President or Prime Minister, had this love and generosity to children - the adults of the future - this world could change completely in one generation!

It is long past the time to cling to old ways and destructive behavior while claiming it is "part of our culture". African-Americans are not immune from evolving to a higher state of living and being.


It might have been a "bad" thing to whip Michael (even though many parents disciplined their children this way, and even still do today), but I think the fact that Michael became such a great, determined, hard working performer can partially be contributed to this...the stern attitude of his father. Michael called his own father a "genius" in a few interviews (including the Bashit interview, in a scene edited out of the final cut). Michael mentioned in an interview that sometimes he hated rehearsing, but his father would whip them into shape.

I'm telling you, this was a very common thing in his era, and sure that doesn't make it "right", but many kids from that era have turned out fine as adults today. I know some adults who now, looking back, thank their parents for being so strict with them. But hey, it affects everyone differently...
 
When I watched the LWMJ for the first time, it was so obvious that this man, Bashir, was aiming to deceive. I couldn't watch it without a weird sense that something was wrong and that it wasn't going to be good for Michael.

This was a catalyst to Michael finally bringing the negative hits against him to light and getting it examined by the fans and those who would understand that conspiracies "live" and they can break you, if you let them.

It was something that had to happen, no doubt.


I'm telling you, this was a very common thing in his era, and sure that doesn't make it "right", but many kids from that era have turned out fine as adults today. I know some adults who now, looking back, thank their parents for being so strict with them. But hey, it affects everyone differently...

A lot of us know about this era and you are right, it wasn't considered a big deal back then to get your butt whooped. Now the reasons for getting your butt whooped could be questionable. But when children know why they are getting spanked it makes more sense to the child, rather then them getting spanked for the sake of getting a beating.

That's where the discrepancy comes in. Of course, today's children get spanking, and no one really loves to get them (unless they are sadistic). It's a matter of knowing what works with your children. Michael and his brothers maybe didn't need the spankings and they would have been served better to get a "sit down and talking to", but that doesn't always work with some children.

After a while, sometimes parents get frustrated and agitated and a butt whooping is what's coming to you if you don't straightened up your act.

I came out all right and I knew that my mother loved me when she disciplined me with a spanking. I didn't get many of them because I was a smart little girl.:D It didn't kill me, it made me a much better person.
 
Giving "hero" status to abusive parents is a sad thing indeed. If you are interested in Michael Jackson, his relationship with his father and his philosophy on children, read his speech that he presented at Oxford University - that says it all.

http://www.allmichaeljackson.com/speeches/oxforduni01.html

Michael Jackson has a highly developed philosophy in regards to children and it is one that I support wholeheartedly. He has single handedly given more to sick, orphaned, handicapped and poor children than any other public figure. Imagine if just one major political figure, like a President or Prime Minister, had this love and generosity to children - the adults of the future - this world could change completely in one generation!

It is long past the time to cling to old ways and destructive behavior while claiming it is "part of our culture". African-Americans are not immune from evolving to a higher state of living and being.

WOW, that was beautiful, I don't know how to discribe this,...
Thank you for pointing this speach out!!!
I'm only 18 and I think I'm still very childlike sometimes but, that's okay, I can be serious too.
I had a nice childhood but I know my mum didn't.
She sometimes speaks about it and she choose to raise me and my sister in a very different way.
She was strict but she promised to herself that she would never beat us.
We weren't spoiled but I'm happy we never were beaten, if you can solve everything without hurting the child, then why would you do it?
We knew what we could or couldn't do and I believe every child has to know their limits.
As we grew up, we got more freedom so we could get to know our own limits:)

Anyway, this was a very long speach but it was absolutely worth reading, I believe in a better world and I want to raise happy children:)
 
Geez, what are yall fussing about.....Joe Jackson again?

Shoot, I got my butt whipped when I was little and I turned out ok.

I really think this issue is a matter of individual beliefs/religion, etc.

No side is totally right.

I, personally, will not whip my children. But I will punished them, "time out" them and/or remove privileges.

Michael loves and respects his father. The media makes me mad when they are constantly trying to get him to say something bad about his father.


I agree.. I was brought up on belts, switches, you name it. I had to go outside and pick my own switch a lot of the times.. It was the only way my father knew how to handle things. And his father did it to him, and probably my grandfathers father did it to him to. It's what they know. I don't really agree with that method and I don't plan on ever laying a finger on my children. It hurts wayy more on the inside then the outside.
 
You are the only person on this thread to have responded in regards to this speech and I appreciate your having read it and your comment. I would hope that everyone interested in Michael Jackson would have read this beautiful speech because not only does it reveal so much about Michael Jackson, his journey and his relationship with his father, it shows others how to cope with abuse from one's parents when you yourself become parents! It is just a great thought from great mind! I think this speech reveals more about Mj than the Bashir Doc does.
 
I agree.. I was brought up on belts, switches, you name it. I had to go outside and pick my own switch a lot of the times.. It was the only way my father knew how to handle things. And his father did it to him, and probably my grandfathers father did it to him to. It's what they know. I don't really agree with that method and I don't plan on ever laying a finger on my children. It hurts way more on the inside then the outside.

i agree. the emotional pain is far greater than the physical. it leaves a psychological scar that may haunt one for the rest of his life. i am also a parent and sometimes i think giving physical punishment to kids is necessary as a form of discipline but we shld know when to draw the line. there is such a thing as too much and obviously joe jackson overdid it. why give him props for that?
 
I absolutely believe that much of this spanking talk have been grossly exaggerated. I have been watching the jacksons and I have been listening to all of the children. NONE of them show simptoms of abuse to me. This is my opinion.
I have worked with children from deprived backgrounds. I have had to report abuse to authorites. I have written up reports of abuse kids and I have sat in on confrences for abuse children. I have also studied child psychology as part of my teaching degree. I can pick out an abused child from a distance, and in my experience the Jackson children do not fall into that category
Yes, they had strict parenting and they had their backside chopped as many of their era did. Unfortunately their is a tendency for the media to overplay anything Jackson and make a big deal out of it. Here in Britain, children were still getting the slipper by their teachers in school until it was completey abolished sometime in the 80's. So Joe Jackson was not the only one whipping his kids.
I have listened to the neighbours talking about the very happy household of the jacksons. Abused children do not have happy households.
Kathrine Jackson and the kids sang songs and harmonised in the house when the kids were small. Abused kids do not get love from parents.
David Guest said the jackson household was the only place where he ever felt loved. An abused household is devoid of love.
MJ said he learned to be strong and to do his best from his dad, who taught him that no star is too high to reach. An abusive father do not teach his children principles.
An adult that was abused by his father would not claim to be just like his father.
I heard Marlon talked about the time when they got a 'SPANKING' from dad. He spoke with a smile and a lot of charm he was not bitter.
An abused child doesn't stop the game he is playing to go seek out his dad to come and join in. When MJ invited his dad to come and join, he spoke with much friendliness and authority in his voice, not someone who was afraid of his dad.
The Jacksons, an American Dream only showed 2 incidents of beating. One with Tito and one with Marlon. All the children were party to that film including Michael. The actor who played Joseph did not do Joseph justice cause he was much taller than joe, thus making him look more intimidating, and he spoke with a hard and loud voice. Joseph has a very quiet, almost mumbling voice, just like Michael.

While I am at it, I would like to add that Janet has said in an interview that she had no spankings and she never witnessed any. Now Janet is only 8 years younger than Michael, so if she didn't get any and didn't see any, then it must have happened before she was born.
Another thing. The idea that joe whipped those boys to perform on stage had to have been before Motown since it was actually Susanne De passe who trained those boys during the Motown days and not Joe jackson. Joe lost control of his boys after he signed them over to Motown,
And another thing. Michael and Marlon spent about a year with Diana Ross during there transition to hollywood.

Katrine has spoken up for Joseph on numerous occasion and denied any abuse.

Lastly. Tell me why would the jackson children sit down and penn a song and make a video about 2300 Jackson street, if the experience was so aweful? Michael sang the bridge to that song. here are some of the words.

Memories of growing up and working hard our childhood passed us by
Mom and dad sacrificed their wants and needs so we could reach the light
Although the times were tough for us we knew they both worked hard
They gave us all their heart could give
And still make room for love

We're all united, and standing strong, and still today we're one big family

2300 Jackson street , we're always home.:punk:

Doesn't sound like them kids were unhappy in Jackson street does it, if they are all writing and singing about the love they had from Mom and DAD :D

Some of you fans want to wrap MJ up in cotton wool, you would carry him if he ask you to, but that would not have got him through the trial that he went through.
Michael gave his father credit for that. And that is the reality, that a man of colour has to be ready and strong to meet the shi.t that life throws at him. Living in Gary was not easy. Violence by the mobs or the cops could leave a black man hanging from the trees. Joe took his children from Gary by hook but not crook. I am happy that Joe bust MJ's ass,and that MJ can sit up in his pent house and reflect on how it was rather that from the jail house reflecting on how things might have been.
When that dj friend, Steve Harvey, was walking in the lift with Mj, MJ told him that he had chewing gum on his shows, Steve said, 'what you showing it to me for, clean off you shows in the carpet'. Michael laughed. Steve thought that Mj was so pampered that nobody had ever talked to him like that before, and MJ loved it too. Black people believe that they have to toughen up their kids to prepare them for the oppression that they face everyday. No one can argue that MJ has not had his fair share of oppression and violence, almost unprecedented. but Joe did a good job of preparing him for his position in life.
As I have said before. God did bless joseph and Kathrine Jacksonn so who is it that thinks he knew more than God :eek:Amen.
 
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Ok this is a heated topic cause of you know who ;) but dispite all his B.S i still think its a very good documentry about MJ sure some secens are abit to personal for him but people want to know the man behind the Music mayby thats why he done it in the first place

Yeah, MJ wanted peeps to know more about him...it is just too bad he picked Bashir to do it. Bashir seemed to have a hidden agenda from the get-go. He turned things and twisted things so badly in that video....I was outraged by what the man did to try to destroy MJ in the public eye. I feel that Bashir should be made never to work again in the public eye.. He was absolutely the wrong choice for this.

As for MJ's dad... you have to realize. This was back in the late 50's early 60's. Back then, corporal punishment was the only way that some parents dealt with "bad behavior"....In lots of parts of the South and Midwest, corporal punishment is still going on. I used to be a Girl Scout Leader...and one little girl's mom would yell "Brandy!! You behave, y'hear girl? Or you is fixin to git yerself a switch!". That is how it is done. It may not be right, and some parents might cringe about it....but that was the way it was back then. Fortunately, as time went forward, we learned the error of our ways...MJ found a way to love his Dad after all this...probably cause he realizes that that was the only way he knew how to raise his children....but is vowing NOT to do the same thing if HE ever had children. Personally, I think MJ is an absolutely stunning father. He is doing so many things with his children...spending so much precious quality time with them...not too many stars of his stature can say the same thing about the amount of time they can spend with their kids...
 
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Well, you can't really assess if the beatings are being exaggerated, because you've never directly spoken to any of the Jackson children. From Michael's descriptions, from the way he's said he reacts to his father, or did, and the way he's reacted when asked about the diciplin, I think it's clear that he was deeply affected. I've heard other descriptions given by some of his brothres which are in line with what Michael says, and Michael's also talked in private to his friends about this, such as Jane Fonda and Elizabeth Taylor. He told Jane Fonda that he and his brothers were so scared of their father that they would hide in their bedroom and lock the door when they heard him coming home. Michael isn't exaggerating the actual beatings. What may seem exaggerated to you is his reaction to them. But again, those are his feelings and it is how it affected him inside, on a personal level. We can't claim that Michael wasn't affected when HE says he was. If he wasn't, then he wouldn't be so admiment over the issue of using physical diciplin on children. He strongly opposes it and there's a reason for that. It affects each child differently. Michael obviously had a bad reaction to it and it hurt him emotionally, so while we shouldn't insult his father, we shouldn't be foreced to agree or praise his tactics. I think that certain fans feel Michael owes everything to his father. He doesn't. He owes some of his success to him, but he owes a lot of that to his own talent and genius and to God. If we're going to give Joe credit for some of the good things, then we can also give his father credit for some of Michael's self-esteem issues. Nobody is perfect and Joe made a mistake in how he brought his children up I think. I don't think its ever okay to hit somebody who is unable to defend themselves. Michael hasn't turned out as what I would label "okay", I think he has a lot of hurt. Not all of that is from his father, but some of it is, and Michael himself has said those words exactly. I don't think it's at all fair to deny Michael his emotions and what he feels inside.
 
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Well, you can't really assess if the beatings are being exaggerated, because you've never directly spoken to any of the Jackson children. From Michael's descriptions, from the way he's said he reacts to his father, or did, and the way he's reacted when asked about the diciplin, I think it's clear that he was deeply affected. I've heard other descriptions given by some of his brothres which are in line with what Michael says, and Michael's also talked in private to his friends about this, such as Jane Fonda and Elizabeth Taylor. He told Jane Fonda that he and his brothers were so scared of their father that they would hide in their bedroom and lock the door when they heard him coming home. Michael isn't exaggerating the actual beatings. What may seem exaggerated to you is his reaction to them. But again, those are his feelings and it is how it affected him inside, on a personal level. We can't claim that Michael wasn't affected when HE says he was. If he wasn't, then he wouldn't be so admiment over the issue of using physical diciplin on children. He strongly opposes it and there's a reason for that. It affects each child differently. Michael obviously had a bad reaction to it and it hurt him emotionally, so while we shouldn't insult his father, we shouldn't be foreced to agree or praise his tactics. I think that certain fans feel Michael owes everything to his father. He doesn't. He owes some of his success. But he can also give his father credit for some of his self-esteem issues too. Nobody is perfect and Joe made a mistake in how he brought his children up. I don't think its ever okay to hit somebody who is unable to defend themselves.

Most of the people who like to talk about Mj's deprived background are people who actually think that there is something wrong with MJ psychologically. If you feel that way then that is fine by me, but I don't think Mj would appreciate it. I personally think that mJ is one of the strongest man I know and very sound in mind too. He is not suffering from any low self esteem. He is strong and is PROUD of who he is. There is nothiong wrong with him. his parents taught him well, and there was a whole lot of love cominjg from 2300 Jackson street.
For your information, I have NEVER condoned corporal punishment. I have argued against it before it became fashionable to do. But I will never condemn Joe or call him names because he did what he thought was right, just because my philosophy dictates otherwise. That is unreasonable.
My parents brought me up as a christian because they thought it was he right thing to do. I suffered a lot of emotional damage by going to my church. I don't go anymore, but I could never blame my mother for doing what she thought was right.:)
 
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Yeah, MJ wanted peeps to know more about him...it is just too bad he picked Bashir to do it. Bashir seemed to have a hidden agenda from the get-go. He turned things and twisted things so badly in that video....I was outraged by what the man did to try to destroy MJ in the public eye. I feel that Bashir should be made never to work again in the public eye.. He was absolutely the wrong choice for this.

As for MJ's dad... you have to realize. This was back in the late 50's early 60's. Back then, corporal punishment was the only way that some parents dealt with "bad behavior"....In lots of parts of the South and Midwest, corporal punishment is still going on. I used to be a Girl Scout Leader...and one little girl's mom would yell "Brandy!! You behave, y'hear girl? Or you is fixin to git yerself a switch!". That is how it is done. It may not be right, and some parents might cringe about it....but that was the way it was back then. Fortunately, as time went forward, we learned the error of our ways...
Thank you so much.We all can look back and see things that could have been done differently, but when we are caught up in the moment we don't have time to think.
I am glad Mj doesn't use the switch on his children. But he is coming from a different place where he is rich anbd he has nannies and he doesn't work in a steal mill and have to worry about putting food on the table. He is free of those things so he has more time to reflect on how it should and could have been.:)
 
Thank you so much.We all can look back and see things that could have been done differently, but when we are caught up in the moment we don't have time to think.
I am glad Mj doesn't use the switch on his children. But he is coming from a different place where he is rich anbd he has nannies and he doesn't work in a steal mill and have to worry about putting food on the table. He is free of those things so he has more time to reflect on how it should and could have been.:)

Amen to THAT Datsymay...couldn't imagine how tough life was back then for his dad, working in the steel mills...secretly wishing and hoping that some day he could get his family out of dire poverty like that...it must have been very stressful for him. I hope and think that MJ understands that now...and has grown to love his dad....You can't blame your parents for what they did to you growing up. You just have to realize that all of us were NOT born with "user manuals" and that just because you are a parent, you are going to do everything letter perfect. Noone is letter perfect. And as we grow older, we come to realize the simple fact that our parents were also human beings, capable of doing things that weren't necessarily in the best interest of their children. Parents ARE just human beings, with all of the flaws, insecurities and foibles that ALL of us have at one point or another in our lives..
 
I didn't call Joe any names though Datsy. And I never have. I just think he made a mistake. I also disagree with you that Michael doesn't suffer from emotional issues. I don't think he is mentally unsound, I just think he does have some very real emotional pain and I base that off of what Michael himself has said. You don't have to agree, but that's what I feel, because Michael himself has said so. I know Joe was only doing what he knew how, but I still think it was wrong, I know that there are other, just as affective forms of diciplin he could have used, and I do think it had a negative impact on Michael and his siblings. I'm just being honest with how I see it.
 
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Well according to michaels OWN MOUTH, the beatings caused him a lot of pain for a long time...and of course it wasnt just the physical abuse but verbal.....so to say it was exaggerated is undermining MJ's own versions of what happened.
 
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Well according to michaels OWN MOUTH, the beatings caused him a lot of pain for a long time...and of course it wasnt just the physical abuse but verbal.....so to say it was exaggerated is undermining MJ's own versions of what happened.

I'm personally glad that MJ can talk about this painful chapter of his life...it always helps to get that stuff off your chest. It's therapeutic....and I do not doubt that that stuff hurt him....but he's older now. He now knows what he will not do to his own children....and that is good. I hope that he can continue to verbalize this hurt....cause it is no good keeping all of that hurt inside...
 
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