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"They're trying to poison me., They're trying to kill me"

I have a question, I'm watching Michael Jackson:The Final Days, they said it was reported that Michael called his manager and said that he was feeling sick that night, has that been confirmed? Orianthi Panagaris (his guitarist who we see in the This is It clip) said that they rehearsed 6 days a week and he was always in great spirits and she said he seemed perfectly fine that night.
 
The more I read the more scary it gets.

If it's true about Sony, AEG etc. then (I hate to say it) the investigation will lead nowhere and there will probably be one guy to blame.
They got what they wanted if that is the case.
But, Michael would earn a huge amount of money with This Is It and I had no idea that he would be worth more dead than alive, so that would in a way explain my question -WHY kill him?!?-. But then again, I just don't get it. It's too much, so hard to digest.

Btw, I was surprised to hear Tommy Mottola talking on CNN shortly after the news broke out.

Those with -Michael was in great health and spirits- comments had / have to stick to their stories otherwise they would be held responsible for not expressing their concerns.

I also think that it is very likely that Michael knew that something serious was going on.

I'm having hard time understanding that someone or "they" could take complete control over his life and that there wasn't a single thing he could do about it.
 
The title freaks me out... Oh my god if this is true.. I havent read the transcript... The first time LaToya said ''My brother was murdered'', I believed her words!
 
mj_sanya_7 said:
The more I read the more scary it gets.

But, Michael would earn a huge amount of money with This Is It and I had no idea that he would be worth more dead than alive, so that would in a way explain my question -WHY kill him?!?-. But then again, I just don't get it. It's too much, so hard to digest.
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It goes like this. Suppose, in the summer of 2008, Tohme began to negotiate a deal with Randy Phillips and AEG, "for" Michael. In the summer of 2008, Michael was extremely thin. He was even photographed in a wheelchair. So maybe AEG didn't think that Michael could actually DO the concerts, but had other ideas? They took out a massive insurance policy on him. Who else has insurance policies on him? Frank? Who else? They also planned to film reheasals, and planned for a line of products? In terms of Sony, the record sales would be enormous if Michael died. And that's exactly what's happened. Plus, there was that idea of NeverLand as a theme park, which would only work if Michael died. Plus, now Sony has the chance of acquiring the ATV catalog. Michael's family will have NO say in that if the catalog is sold.

Michael signed a contract to do ten shows. Then they morphed into fifty. He was trapped! Michael seemed to pull himself together and it looked like the concerts could actually happen? But still, he wasn't in physical condition to pull off all fifty. The insurance perhaps would pay out much MORE if he died, rather than simply cancelled. Plus if he died, there would be the increase in record sales, people wanting products, and the movie made from rehearsals. The concerts were iffy. He could have collapsed -- gotten sick and cancelled. But a MOVIE? It's a sure thing, with no unpleasant surprises. It will do extremely well at the box-office. And even the tickets for the concerts! Instead of refunds, some fans are getting the actual tickets as souvenirs, with no refund. That's another win for AEG.

So what about the insurance physical? Maybe it was real, or maybe it was fraud? Was the doctor paid-off? Or did someone ELSE take the physical? E-Cass? The policy said "no pre-existing conditions." Michael really DID have lupus. Lupus is a chronic illness, with flare-ups due to stress. Lupus IS a pre-existing condition, and it can be serious. So what, exactly, happened?

At some point there was a power-move, and Tohme was out and Dileo was in. Same basic plan, though? (Does Dileo have connections with AEG? What are they?) So maybe Michael wasn't in great shape, but he was TRYING. Enter Murray. Suppose Murray was giving him Ephedra without his knowledge? Mixed in with his breakfasts and other meals? It would have caused weight-loss, anxiety, and insomnia. And other problems. Murray had the solution. Drugs, and especially Propofol. Everyone underestimated Michael's motivation and mental stamina. He WAS trying. He wasn't dying fast enough. He was packing to go to London. So. . Murray killed him. A "do or die" moment.

And what about Murray? Doctors make the best assassins. Of all people, he would have the least penalty for murder. He was going broke. He was having an affair (blackmail?) If he's charged with manslaughter, he might just get probation. When that ends he could leave the country, pick up a nice, fat, check, and spend the rest of his life on a tropical beach with a drink with a little umbrella in it?

Look who's cashing in? Michael's record sales are making a lot of bucks for Sony. Sony is in partnership with AEG for the movie. Products are selling, and so on. We don't know how much insurance AEG got. . . . yet. And Frank? He still thinks he's Michael's manager, even after death!

Think of it this way? The risk for AEG was ENORMOUS, if Michael did the concerts. He hadn't performed in many years, and certainly not a string of concerts. He had no record to promote. I just can't see how he'd be READY for fifty concerts. But with him gone, the money flows in, without the risk.

It's time for some arrests, and for justice! I don't' know if my scenario is accurate, but it sure does make sense. . . .
 
If I hadn't added this before, lemme do it now:

Michael first started to accurately suspect being poisoned in 2005 during the trial, now think for a second WHO had access to him and his food or Medicine intake during that time. You gotta have a real close, one on one and regular interaction with someone in order for this to be done. Getting that close had to come with a level of trust. Think about that for a moment.

Whoever was doing that to Michael in 2005 had to have either DIRECTLY or INDIRECTLY passed the torch to the newer group of crooks and criminals who would take over from that point on.

I just hope and pray Dick Gregory is Interviewed and gives a Statement so this could be part of the official Investigation.
 
During the trial, I had a "Michael-dream." I was at NeverLand, to see him. The house was FULL of people. At first, i thought it was a party going on? I asked someone, "Where's Michael?" The person said, "Oh, he's not feeling well. He's taking a nap." I never did see him. But then I began to hear conversations. It wasn't a party at all. It was a PLOT. Everyone in that house was plotting against Michael. Grace was there, and Frank, and Randy Jackson, and a lot of other people. I wanted to warn Michael, but I couldn't FIND him. . couldn't find his room. And then, of course, I woke up.

There were leads that suggested the Arvizos were HIRED by someone, and paid by someone. I think the trial was no accident. What did Michael have that a corporation WANTED? Well?
 
Victoria83, you've summed it up perfectly!
Thank you for that!



I only don’t understand who is responsible for the ATV catalog now? Who makes decisions about it?
It confuses me alot :(







 
Victoria83 said:
It goes like this. Suppose, in the summer of 2008, Tohme began to negotiate a deal with Randy Phillips and AEG, "for" Michael. In the summer of 2008, Michael was extremely thin. He was even photographed in a wheelchair. So maybe AEG didn't think that Michael could actually DO the concerts, but had other ideas? They took out a massive insurance policy on him. Who else has insurance policies on him? Frank? Who else? They also planned to film reheasals, and planned for a line of products? In terms of Sony, the record sales would be enormous if Michael died. And that's exactly what's happened. Plus, there was that idea of NeverLand as a theme park, which would only work if Michael died. Plus, now Sony has the chance of acquiring the ATV catalog. Michael's family will have NO say in that if the catalog is sold.

Michael signed a contract to do ten shows. Then they morphed into fifty. He was trapped! Michael seemed to pull himself together and it looked like the concerts could actually happen? But still, he wasn't in physical condition to pull off all fifty. The insurance perhaps would pay out much MORE if he died, rather than simply cancelled. Plus if he died, there would be the increase in record sales, people wanting products, and the movie made from rehearsals. The concerts were iffy. He could have collapsed -- gotten sick and cancelled. But a MOVIE? It's a sure thing, with no unpleasant surprises. It will do extremely well at the box-office. And even the tickets for the concerts! Instead of refunds, some fans are getting the actual tickets as souvenirs, with no refund. That's another win for AEG.

So what about the insurance physical? Maybe it was real, or maybe it was fraud? Was the doctor paid-off? Or did someone ELSE take the physical? E-Cass? The policy said "no pre-existing conditions." Michael really DID have lupus. Lupus is a chronic illness, with flare-ups due to stress. Lupus IS a pre-existing condition, and it can be serious. So what, exactly, happened?

At some point there was a power-move, and Tohme was out and Dileo was in. Same basic plan, though? (Does Dileo have connections with AEG? What are they?) So maybe Michael wasn't in great shape, but he was TRYING. Enter Murray. Suppose Murray was giving him Ephedra without his knowledge? Mixed in with his breakfasts and other meals? It would have caused weight-loss, anxiety, and insomnia. And other problems. Murray had the solution. Drugs, and especially Propofol. Everyone underestimated Michael's motivation and mental stamina. He WAS trying. He wasn't dying fast enough. He was packing to go to London. So. . Murray killed him. A "do or die" moment.

And what about Murray? Doctors make the best assassins. Of all people, he would have the least penalty for murder. He was going broke. He was having an affair (blackmail?) If he's charged with manslaughter, he might just get probation. When that ends he could leave the country, pick up a nice, fat, check, and spend the rest of his life on a tropical beach with a drink with a little umbrella in it?

Look who's cashing in? Michael's record sales are making a lot of bucks for Sony. Sony is in partnership with AEG for the movie. Products are selling, and so on. We don't know how much insurance AEG got. . . . yet. And Frank? He still thinks he's Michael's manager, even after death!

Think of it this way? The risk for AEG was ENORMOUS, if Michael did the concerts. He hadn't performed in many years, and certainly not a string of concerts. He had no record to promote. I just can't see how he'd be READY for fifty concerts. But with him gone, the money flows in, without the risk.

It's time for some arrests, and for justice! I don't' know if my scenario is accurate, but it sure does make sense. . . .
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That makes so much sense! I applaud you Victoria, for once again giving an easy to read and EXTREMELY plausable scenario :clapping:

I agree too IT'S TIME FOR JUSTICE FOR OUR MICHAEL!
 
TheLastTear said:
Victoria83, you've summed it up perfectly!
Thank you for that!



I only don’t understand who is responsible for the ATV catalog now? Who makes decisions about it?
It confuses me alot :(
Click to expand...


I'd like to know more about the deal around the sony/atv catelogue too especially I'd like to know whether there was any clause or terms that would have meant Michael would have been able to have regain control of his catelogue in the near future, as I've heard this said a few times, so not sure what the situation was
 
The executors of the estate now control the ATV catalog. They could choose to sell it, and there would be nothing Katherine could do about it. I doubt they'd do it soon, though. Too suspicious. But watch for it. . . . .

Yeah, can anyone look up when Michael had the option to buy-back the other half? Strange, though, how many documents have now disappeared from the internet? :ph34r:
 
Gaiaschild said:
I'd like to know more about the deal around the sony/atv catelogue too especially I'd like to know whether there was any clause or terms that would have meant Michael would have been able to have regain control of his catelogue in the near future, as I've heard this said a few times, so not sure what the situation was
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I've found this....

"Jackson was guaranteed a cash distribution of $11 million a year from the venture through September 2011, according to the May 25, 2007, document that was signed by the pop star.The document also detailed Sony's ability to buy an unspecified percentage of Jackson's remaining share in Sony/ATV.It said Sony agreed to guarantee loans made to Jackson through September 2011 and to help him refinance his debts......"


http://www.whynotad.com/advertising/Sonyatv-Music-Publishing-Catalog
 
Victoria83 said:
The executors of the estate now control the ATV catalog. They could choose to sell it, and there would be nothing Katherine could do about it. I doubt they'd do it soon, though. Too suspicious. But watch for it. . . . .

Yeah, can anyone look up when Michael had the option to buy-back the other half? Strange, though, how many documents have now disappeared from the internet? :ph34r:
Click to expand...

But, that is not what Michael wanted. We all know that :no:
 
Gaiaschild said:
I'd like to know more about the deal around the sony/atv catelogue too especially I'd like to know whether there was any clause or terms that would have meant Michael would have been able to have regain control of his catelogue in the near future, as I've heard this said a few times, so not sure what the situation was
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me too; that post didnt sum it up for me it only alluded to not holding AEG or SONY in anyway responisible for Michael's Homicide. Michael had a Signed contract with a required Physical wheter fake or real it was done by AEG orders and they where TOTALLY responsible for anyone they allowed around Michael and anyone that want to believe AEG and SONY didnt know EVERYTHING and EVERYONE that was going on and in that DeathHouse has to be on another planet, there is no way out of a WrongFul Death LawSuit against AEG and SONY especially now that its ruled a HOMICIDE no matter what level - Homicide means a Person has been Murdered wheter you want to call it Negligent or Intent, I just hope Katherine Jackson sue them for at least 500 Billion. Maybe thats why they are letting the Executors run wild with their Selling Sprees of everything that Michael owned. I cant wait for the Wrongful Death Suit because we will find out things that will not come out in this Death Investigation. They have backed themselves in a Corner and the only way they can come out is a FIGHT.
 
MJ#1WhoIsIt said:
me too; that post didnt sum it up for me it only alluded to not holding AEG or SONY in anyway responisible for Michael's Homicide. Michael had a Signed contract with a required Physical wheter fake or real it was done by AEG orders and they where TOTALLY responsible for anyone they allowed around Michael and anyone that want to believe AEG and SONY didnt know EVERYTHING and EVERYONE that was going on and in that DeathHouse has to be on another planet, there is no way out of a WrongFul Death LawSuit against AEG and SONY especially now that its ruled a HOMICIDE no matter what level - Homicide means a Person has been Murdered wheter you want to call it Negligent or Intent, I just hope Katherine Jackson sue them for at least 500 Billion. Maybe thats why they are letting the Executors run wild with their Selling Sprees of everything that Michael owned. I cant wait for the Wrongful Death Suit because we will find out things that will not come out in this Death Investigation. They have backed themselves in a Corner and the only way they can come out is a FIGHT.
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Absolutely, I hope for a Wrongful Death suit. I hope Katherine FIGHTS for Michael, and for his children.
 
I heard a couple of weeks ago on one of the Natl news shows, someone saying There definately will be Wrong Death Civil Law Suits now that Michael's death has been officially ruled a Homicide. When one person said this, the other agreed from the split screen, I just can't remember which program I was watching at the time.
 
Gaiaschild said:
Uri has occult religious symbols on those two drawings, one that was used for invincible and one that wasn't. I've read books by researchers in the past on the meaning of them that the illuminati use these symbols. I know enough to know a bit about what some of them mean from the material I've read, and a little that I was told about the star it is rather strange. I do believe it is highly linked to something, not sure what yet though,my senses tell me and they are usually fairly accurate, but I accept it is not what everyone believes. So I won't mention it again.

I also do not believe Michael was given vitilgo. I know it is an autoimmune disease as a holistic practioner and researcher. I do believe though the technology exists to do that if they wanted, even certain pharmaceuticals can cause immune system problems, and auto immune disease, as well as other problems,but I just don't think they did it to Michael.
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I totally agree with you Gaiaschild. I looked more closely at those symbols recently, I have also done some research into it and think that it's very strange someone would want to put this on a friend's album cover.

I also just wanted to say, not everyone will agree with other peoples opinions all the time and many of us are researching different areas in order to find the truth we seek. We are conducting an investigation and therefore EVERY angle needs to be covered. Each of us are finding links and following our own intuition in order to find answers. There is nothing wrong with that and I don't think people should be made to feel they cannot say certain things or discuss their information with others. If we all research different areas, yes we will meet dead ends at times but we will cover more ground more quickily and eventually our information will all link together. We are all entitled to have our own opinions and follow our own intuition because we all want justice for Michael and his family.
 
Oh my God, Vic - that post just blew me away! WOW. Thanx.
It makes sense that's for sure.

E-Cass?! Wtf?! No pre-existing conditions?! Hmm. Money flowing in with no risks. Too much $*&% going on. I can't believe AEG. Plus, Thome is very shady.
Well now, you're confusing me with Dileo.

If we're still talking about Sony that adds up to the trial theory.
Plus, as someone just said that he was being poisoned during the trial, too.
It seems it all started then. And I hear you - Michael's mental stamina.
Some people said Grace, now THAT would be so hard to believe!????

All this that is going on makes me more aware of the situation Michael was in for a long time during his life. I haven't really realized until recently how dangerous, complicated and stressful it was in his world and there was almost no one to trust. Such complex circumstances.

I don't know what else to think but what he said on 60 minutes - people around him, conspiracy.
 
Julia55 said:
I totally agree with you Gaiaschild. I looked more closely at those symbols recently, I have also done some research into it and think that it's very strange someone would want to put this on a friend's album cover.

I also just wanted to say, not everyone will agree with other peoples opinions all the time and many of us are researching different areas in order to find the truth we seek. We are conducting an investigation and therefore EVERY angle needs to be covered. Each of us are finding links and following our own intuition in order to find answers. There is nothing wrong with that and I don't think people should be made to feel they cannot say certain things or discuss their information with others. If we all research different areas, yes we will meet dead ends at times but we will cover more ground more quickily and eventually our information will all link together. We are all entitled to have our own opinions and follow our own intuition because we all want justice for Michael and his family.
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Thank you Julia.
 
Victoria83 said:
It goes like this. Suppose, in the summer of 2008, Tohme began to negotiate a deal with Randy Phillips and AEG, "for" Michael. In the summer of 2008, Michael was extremely thin. He was even photographed in a wheelchair. So maybe AEG didn't think that Michael could actually DO the concerts, but had other ideas? They took out a massive insurance policy on him. Who else has insurance policies on him? Frank? Who else? They also planned to film reheasals, and planned for a line of products? In terms of Sony, the record sales would be enormous if Michael died. And that's exactly what's happened. Plus, there was that idea of NeverLand as a theme park, which would only work if Michael died. Plus, now Sony has the chance of acquiring the ATV catalog. Michael's family will have NO say in that if the catalog is sold.

Michael signed a contract to do ten shows. Then they morphed into fifty. He was trapped! Michael seemed to pull himself together and it looked like the concerts could actually happen? But still, he wasn't in physical condition to pull off all fifty. The insurance perhaps would pay out much MORE if he died, rather than simply cancelled. Plus if he died, there would be the increase in record sales, people wanting products, and the movie made from rehearsals. The concerts were iffy. He could have collapsed -- gotten sick and cancelled. But a MOVIE? It's a sure thing, with no unpleasant surprises. It will do extremely well at the box-office. And even the tickets for the concerts! Instead of refunds, some fans are getting the actual tickets as souvenirs, with no refund. That's another win for AEG.

So what about the insurance physical? Maybe it was real, or maybe it was fraud? Was the doctor paid-off? Or did someone ELSE take the physical? E-Cass? The policy said "no pre-existing conditions." Michael really DID have lupus. Lupus is a chronic illness, with flare-ups due to stress. Lupus IS a pre-existing condition, and it can be serious. So what, exactly, happened?

At some point there was a power-move, and Tohme was out and Dileo was in. Same basic plan, though? (Does Dileo have connections with AEG? What are they?) So maybe Michael wasn't in great shape, but he was TRYING. Enter Murray. Suppose Murray was giving him Ephedra without his knowledge? Mixed in with his breakfasts and other meals? It would have caused weight-loss, anxiety, and insomnia. And other problems. Murray had the solution. Drugs, and especially Propofol. Everyone underestimated Michael's motivation and mental stamina. He WAS trying. He wasn't dying fast enough. He was packing to go to London. So. . Murray killed him. A "do or die" moment.

And what about Murray? Doctors make the best assassins. Of all people, he would have the least penalty for murder. He was going broke. He was having an affair (blackmail?) If he's charged with manslaughter, he might just get probation. When that ends he could leave the country, pick up a nice, fat, check, and spend the rest of his life on a tropical beach with a drink with a little umbrella in it?

Look who's cashing in? Michael's record sales are making a lot of bucks for Sony. Sony is in partnership with AEG for the movie. Products are selling, and so on. We don't know how much insurance AEG got. . . . yet. And Frank? He still thinks he's Michael's manager, even after death!

Think of it this way? The risk for AEG was ENORMOUS, if Michael did the concerts. He hadn't performed in many years, and certainly not a string of concerts. He had no record to promote. I just can't see how he'd be READY for fifty concerts. But with him gone, the money flows in, without the risk.

It's time for some arrests, and for justice! I don't' know if my scenario is accurate, but it sure does make sense. . . .
Click to expand...

Wow what a fantatsic post! :clapping:
My head is spinning with all this.I am praying that Katherine can fight and prove that there was more to all this than just Murray.
Michael deserves justice
 
mj_sanya_7 said:
Oh my God, Vic - that post just blew me away! WOW. Thanx.
It makes sense that's for sure.

E-Cass?! Wtf?! No pre-existing conditions?! Hmm. Money flowing in with no risks. Too much $*&% going on. I can't believe AEG. Plus, Thome is very shady.
Well now, you're confusing me with Dileo.

If we're still talking about Sony that adds up to the trial theory.
Plus, as someone just said that he was being poisoned during the trial, too.
It seems it all started then. And I hear you - Michael's mental stamina.
Some people said Grace, now THAT would be so hard to believe!????

All this that is going on makes me more aware of the situation Michael was in for a long time during his life. I haven't really realized until recently how dangerous, complicated and stressful it was in his world and there was almost no one to trust. Such complex circumstances.

I don't know what else to think but what he said on 60 minutes - people around him, conspiracy.
Click to expand...

And remember, it's all theory. I don't have any direct knowledge about the insurance physical and what really happened. It just doesn't make sense, though. I've seen the part about "no pre-existing conditions," and I just don't see how that could be possible!

There remain many questions. Frank sort of appeared out of nowhere, after a twenty-year absence. How? (Yeah, he was at the trial. He slept! Was he there just to worm his way back into the inner-circle?) IS there any connection between him and Tohme, or are they adversaries, or what? Tohme has vanished. What WAS he doing there at the hospital, anyway. And even after he'd been fired, he said he was still doing business on Michael's behalf. How? AND, he had 5.5 million in cash of Michael's money! Shouldn't he have returned that when he was FIRED? I think Michael knew nothing about it.

WHEN did Tohme enter Michael's life? I know something was very, very strange in the summer of 2008. There was that one photo of Michael at Planet Hollywood. He looked even thinner than at the trial. And THEN there were negotiations with AEG? Michael was (and is) a money-maker, for sure. But did he have to be alive to do it? As we see now. . no, he didn't. I think that they never, for ONE second, expected him to be able to do the concerts. But he was TRYING. He was packing to go to London. And then he was. . . gone.

Keep digging .. . . .
 
About being poisoned, people have said that at rehearsals Michael was either in great spirits, or he looked like a walking corpse. Karen even said someone (I can't remember who it was, but I'm sure someone will know what I'm talking about) was literally feeding Michael. That said, from Kai Chase's interviews, she never mentioned Michael eating dinner that night at the house just lunch with the kids, meaning he would have eaten dinner at rehearsals. Then later that night Michael mentions feeling sick....did anyone literally feed him that night?
 
Trish said:
Sorry, ephedrine was found in Michael's system.



And According to Dr. Murray's deposition to the police, he started giving Michael propofol to battle insomnia 6 weeks prior to his death:
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So Ephedra was definitely found in his system... I thought it was banned in the U.S.? If so, then there is only one way he could have gotten it, and that's the idiot "doctor". Michael would not have taken that. He's always eaten healthy and kept himself thin, and he was rehearsing and getting ready to go on tour. No way he would have taken drugs to lose weight.

If he was paranoid to think people were out to get him, then I wish he had been more paranoid. They definitely were out to get him. There simply is no other explanation that makes more sense than that Murray was giving him Ephedra, which wasn't killing him yet, but it was causing anxiety (which he was then given medication for) and insomnia (which he was also given medication for). The doctor had to know the dangers of Ephedra, and yet he gave it to him. He had to see the side effects from it, yet kept giving it to him. Hmmm. Then he also knew the dangers of Propofol but gave that to him too. There is no way around it.
Murray killed Michael, and he deserves to be punished! If I didn't hate him so much, then I'd almost feel sorry for the bastard if he gets away with this. I just hope he talks and tells the others involved and then still gets it too.
 
I think Victoria made valid points :)

What I think also is suspicios is the timing. Just right before he was ready and going to London. They couldn't let him perform because it would have made it harder for people to feed media and readers that he was the druggie they want us to believe. Yeah, he probably wouldn't have gone through all 50 shows and it would have cost AEG money money money. What they have now is media all over Michael, only writing stories how drugged up he was and fans wanting to hold on to their tickets, this way they are making way more money. I believe Michael tried his best to pull it off but AEG didn't want to take the risk and they needed him out. Also these concerts would have given him a lot of confidence and financial independence, and they didn't want it to happen. The timing is so suspicios.
 
butterflies said:
So Ephedra was definitely found in his system... I thought it was banned in the U.S.? If so, then there is only one way he could have gotten it, and that's the idiot "doctor". Michael would not have taken that. He's always eaten healthy and kept himself thin, and he was rehearsing and getting ready to go on tour. No way he would have taken drugs to lose weight.

If he was paranoid to think people were out to get him, then I wish he had been more paranoid. They definitely were out to get him. There simply is no other explanation that makes more sense than that Murray was giving him Ephedra, which wasn't killing him yet, but it was causing anxiety (which he was then given medication for) and insomnia (which he was also given medication for). The doctor had to know the dangers of Ephedra, and yet he gave it to him. He had to see the side effects from it, yet kept giving it to him. Hmmm. Then he also knew the dangers of Propofol but gave that to him too. There is no way around it.
Murray killed Michael, and he deserves to be punished! If I didn't hate him so much, then I'd almost feel sorry for the bastard if he gets away with this. I just hope he talks and tells the others involved and then still gets it too.
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I read up on Ephedra. The public knew a ban on it was coming, and a lot of people stockpiled it, in large quantities. So, it's still around. Athletes used it, and people used it for weight-loss, and so on. I can't imagine Michael would EVER take medication for weight-loss, intentionally. I mean, why would he? There were several otherwise unexplained cardiac arrests in people taking Ephedra. That's why it was taken off the market.

Suppose the doctor WANTED to give Michael drugs, but he wasn't taking any narcotics and didn't want them. So HOW to get drugs into him? The Ephedra would just about do it. He wouldn't know WHY he felt such anxiety. If he was getting a lot of the drug, then he would have been utterly unable to sleep.

I want Murray to sing, and SING! He was not alone in this. . . . . . I'm nearly certain of it, given everything. If I were Murray, I'd be terrified of having some sort of bad accident, caused by whoever hired him to do. . what he did. This is just speculation, of course, but. . . . .
 
should be really interesting to hear from Frank Dileo through the MJJC interview because you know the questions asked are pushing for the answers and not the vague responses given to the media outlets,the thing is IF one goes down they could all go down,so if Murray is arrested and charged im betting things are heat up if hes faced with a long sentence,im sure Frank knows a whole bunch of fans who he could claimed to have spoken to on the 25th,if mike would have said 'there trying to kill me and poison me' then im thinking why would he have been given injections of sleeping aids and have his doctor bring up food from downstairs.It does seem very paranoid.
 
Victoria83 said:
I read up on Ephedra. The public knew a ban on it was coming, and a lot of people stockpiled it, in large quantities. So, it's still around. Athletes used it, and people used it for weight-loss, and so on. I can't imagine Michael would EVER take medication for weight-loss, intentionally. I mean, why would he? There were several otherwise unexplained cardiac arrests in people taking Ephedra. That's why it was taken off the market.

Suppose the doctor WANTED to give Michael drugs, but he wasn't taking any narcotics and didn't want them. So HOW to get drugs into him? The Ephedra would just about do it. He wouldn't know WHY he felt such anxiety. If he was getting a lot of the drug, then he would have been utterly unable to sleep.

I want Murray to sing, and SING! He was not alone in this. . . . . . I'm nearly certain of it, given everything. If I were Murray, I'd be terrified of having some sort of bad accident, caused by whoever hired him to do. . what he did. This is just speculation, of course, but. . . . .
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Something definitely stinks about the ephedrine in the coroner's report. It lept out at me straight away. Is it possible tho that MJ just used it for a cold? I doubt it - I mean ever since Murray came on the scene that's when his weight started dropping more, it coincides well. Also didn't they find phen-phen in one of Murray's offices, with possible links to Michael? This is a similar drug to ephedrine.

Murray has s**t loads of explaining to do, hope the cops ask the right questions. I'm so worried that something important like this will just be overlooked or missed. Another thing that needs looking in to is why was there no adrenaline (epinephrine) mentioned in the coroner's report. This is almost always used in resus emergencies.
 
Victoria83 said:
It goes like this. Suppose, in the summer of 2008, Tohme began to negotiate a deal with Randy Phillips and AEG, "for" Michael. In the summer of 2008, Michael was extremely thin. He was even photographed in a wheelchair. So maybe AEG didn't think that Michael could actually DO the concerts, but had other ideas? They took out a massive insurance policy on him. Who else has insurance policies on him? Frank? Who else? They also planned to film reheasals, and planned for a line of products? In terms of Sony, the record sales would be enormous if Michael died. And that's exactly what's happened. Plus, there was that idea of NeverLand as a theme park, which would only work if Michael died. Plus, now Sony has the chance of acquiring the ATV catalog. Michael's family will have NO say in that if the catalog is sold.

Michael signed a contract to do ten shows. Then they morphed into fifty. He was trapped! Michael seemed to pull himself together and it looked like the concerts could actually happen? But still, he wasn't in physical condition to pull off all fifty. The insurance perhaps would pay out much MORE if he died, rather than simply cancelled. Plus if he died, there would be the increase in record sales, people wanting products, and the movie made from rehearsals. The concerts were iffy. He could have collapsed -- gotten sick and cancelled. But a MOVIE? It's a sure thing, with no unpleasant surprises. It will do extremely well at the box-office. And even the tickets for the concerts! Instead of refunds, some fans are getting the actual tickets as souvenirs, with no refund. That's another win for AEG.

So what about the insurance physical? Maybe it was real, or maybe it was fraud? Was the doctor paid-off? Or did someone ELSE take the physical? E-Cass? The policy said "no pre-existing conditions." Michael really DID have lupus. Lupus is a chronic illness, with flare-ups due to stress. Lupus IS a pre-existing condition, and it can be serious. So what, exactly, happened?

At some point there was a power-move, and Tohme was out and Dileo was in. Same basic plan, though? (Does Dileo have connections with AEG? What are they?) So maybe Michael wasn't in great shape, but he was TRYING. Enter Murray. Suppose Murray was giving him Ephedra without his knowledge? Mixed in with his breakfasts and other meals? It would have caused weight-loss, anxiety, and insomnia. And other problems. Murray had the solution. Drugs, and especially Propofol. Everyone underestimated Michael's motivation and mental stamina. He WAS trying. He wasn't dying fast enough. He was packing to go to London. So. . Murray killed him. A "do or die" moment.

And what about Murray? Doctors make the best assassins. Of all people, he would have the least penalty for murder. He was going broke. He was having an affair (blackmail?) If he's charged with manslaughter, he might just get probation. When that ends he could leave the country, pick up a nice, fat, check, and spend the rest of his life on a tropical beach with a drink with a little umbrella in it?

Look who's cashing in? Michael's record sales are making a lot of bucks for Sony. Sony is in partnership with AEG for the movie. Products are selling, and so on. We don't know how much insurance AEG got. . . . yet. And Frank? He still thinks he's Michael's manager, even after death!

Think of it this way? The risk for AEG was ENORMOUS, if Michael did the concerts. He hadn't performed in many years, and certainly not a string of concerts. He had no record to promote. I just can't see how he'd be READY for fifty concerts. But with him gone, the money flows in, without the risk.

It's time for some arrests, and for justice! I don't' know if my scenario is accurate, but it sure does make sense. . . .
Click to expand...

:bugeyed Yes, it does make sense. Too much sense. OMG, I can't believe this. I wish we would have known about some of this before and could have prevented this. I think you're right, and I just hope that it's all figured out. I know it's a shot in the dark because people with power usually get away with everything.
 
And remember how the chef Kai Chase said that when she came back after being away for 3 weeks then Michael was different .. I wonder who cooked his meals back then and what happened in those 3 weeks.
 
Victoria83 said:
It goes like this. Suppose, in the summer of 2008, Tohme began to negotiate a deal with Randy Phillips and AEG, "for" Michael. In the summer of 2008, Michael was extremely thin. He was even photographed in a wheelchair. So maybe AEG didn't think that Michael could actually DO the concerts, but had other ideas? They took out a massive insurance policy on him. Who else has insurance policies on him? Frank? Who else? They also planned to film reheasals, and planned for a line of products? In terms of Sony, the record sales would be enormous if Michael died. And that's exactly what's happened. Plus, there was that idea of NeverLand as a theme park, which would only work if Michael died. Plus, now Sony has the chance of acquiring the ATV catalog. Michael's family will have NO say in that if the catalog is sold.

Michael signed a contract to do ten shows. Then they morphed into fifty. He was trapped! Michael seemed to pull himself together and it looked like the concerts could actually happen? But still, he wasn't in physical condition to pull off all fifty. The insurance perhaps would pay out much MORE if he died, rather than simply cancelled. Plus if he died, there would be the increase in record sales, people wanting products, and the movie made from rehearsals. The concerts were iffy. He could have collapsed -- gotten sick and cancelled. But a MOVIE? It's a sure thing, with no unpleasant surprises. It will do extremely well at the box-office. And even the tickets for the concerts! Instead of refunds, some fans are getting the actual tickets as souvenirs, with no refund. That's another win for AEG.

So what about the insurance physical? Maybe it was real, or maybe it was fraud? Was the doctor paid-off? Or did someone ELSE take the physical? E-Cass? The policy said "no pre-existing conditions." Michael really DID have lupus. Lupus is a chronic illness, with flare-ups due to stress. Lupus IS a pre-existing condition, and it can be serious. So what, exactly, happened?

At some point there was a power-move, and Tohme was out and Dileo was in. Same basic plan, though? (Does Dileo have connections with AEG? What are they?) So maybe Michael wasn't in great shape, but he was TRYING. Enter Murray. Suppose Murray was giving him Ephedra without his knowledge? Mixed in with his breakfasts and other meals? It would have caused weight-loss, anxiety, and insomnia. And other problems. Murray had the solution. Drugs, and especially Propofol. Everyone underestimated Michael's motivation and mental stamina. He WAS trying. He wasn't dying fast enough. He was packing to go to London. So. . Murray killed him. A "do or die" moment.

And what about Murray? Doctors make the best assassins. Of all people, he would have the least penalty for murder. He was going broke. He was having an affair (blackmail?) If he's charged with manslaughter, he might just get probation. When that ends he could leave the country, pick up a nice, fat, check, and spend the rest of his life on a tropical beach with a drink with a little umbrella in it?

Look who's cashing in? Michael's record sales are making a lot of bucks for Sony. Sony is in partnership with AEG for the movie. Products are selling, and so on. We don't know how much insurance AEG got. . . . yet. And Frank? He still thinks he's Michael's manager, even after death!

Think of it this way? The risk for AEG was ENORMOUS, if Michael did the concerts. He hadn't performed in many years, and certainly not a string of concerts. He had no record to promote. I just can't see how he'd be READY for fifty concerts. But with him gone, the money flows in, without the risk.

It's time for some arrests, and for justice! I don't' know if my scenario is accurate, but it sure does make sense. . . .
Click to expand...


There's another aspect where Sony is concerned too. When Sony BMG became Sony Music after buying out Bertelsmann's share in Sony BMG, BMG's music catalogues were not included as part of the deal.

They couldnt be - because Michael had a non-compete clause with Sony in place. Had BMG's music catalogues been included then Sony Music would then have been directly competing against Sony/ATV.

Sony Music is unique amongst the big four record companies in that it is the ONLY one not to have its own music publishing arm. Sony was and is apparently DESPERATE to change this.

In 2007 it was reported that Sony was negotiating with Michael to have this non compete clause either lifted or amended. It obviously failed. Michael pretty much did have Sony over a barrel where Sony's ambitions for Sony Music are concerned.
 
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