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Merged: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Reghead121 said:
I don't know about all the technical stuff with TII and that... but the coroner's report did point to some minor issues with his spine that could have been a discomfort to him and I've heard a few others talk about Michael having 'dancers feet' before.
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I don't know about the post but what Reghead has posted here is true, and I have heard about Michael's feet before. The coroners report also had markings on the feet of the pencil outline of the body.

Its nothing to really bother about anyway, a lot if not all of dancers have some kind of problem with their feet.. have you seen ballet dancers when they take their pumps off, they have to take good care of their feet.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

what i have a problem with is people saying Michael didn't sound all that good, and yet saying that 'dirty diana' was a masterpiece, at the same time. either it was a masterpiece, or MJ didn't sound all that good. it can't be both. as far as MJ's vocals looking like playback, being obvious, in the movie, i've seen the movie three times, and neither his vocals or the idea of a stand in, look anywhere near obvious to me. that's a complaint that people have had about MJ, most of the latter years of his life. and i never agreed with anyone who said that. and whatever dancing MJ did, didn't reveal back problems. i don't care what anyone says, i've never seen a person with back problems, able to move like MJ did, in that movie..not even for a second. why should MJ be the exception to the rule, that a person can't move, if they have back problems. anyone with problems like that, stop dancing, altogether and retire. MJ moved in the movie, like he did in the thriller era. the other stuff said by this person is a mystery, to me. but if AEG, Phillips and company are underhanded, God will deal with them.
 
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Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Whether this post is true or not I don't know but I don't think this post is trying to be negative saying MJ was incabable in any way.. for example they said dirty diana was really good and they dnt know why it wasn't shown.

i've never seen a person with back problems, able to move like MJ did
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The coroners report showed arthritis in his back. Nobody is saying he's disabled or anything just his back and feet hurt after dancing. Not unusual anyway for a dancer I don't think.

people saying Michael didn't sound all that good,
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It doesn't say anywhere that Michael didn't sound good...

Though I agree with you that any 'lipsyncing' didn't look obvious to me, except in maybe 2 songs.
 
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Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

First of all i dont trust anything anymore. Second Michael was 50 so there is something called Arthritis. it happens to everyone. Michael danced for many many years. so yes im sure his feet hurt and his back.

I don't trust this report as i don't trust many things dealing with this whole thing.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Sorry guys I am drunk I reaaly like this forum but be open minded, this message is full of crap! Don't waste your time on this crap! It's all I wanted to say! :angel:
Trust Kenny Ortega, Travis Payne, not this author! He is full of shit!
I HATE when people make up things out of nothing! I mean there are some many natural problems in this world... so why do we have to create ones out of nothing? This makes me sick!!! :blink::puke:
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

I think the writer of this is just trying to do what Victoria warned us to watch out for. He is trying to divide us and distract us so we aren't focusing on Murray. We have to stick together!!:better:
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

GinnyJackson said:
First of all i dont trust anything anymore.
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This is where I am now. I've read so much in the last nearly 8 months that my head is spinning. There is only one indisputable fact and that is Michael is gone. (Although some would dispute that).

Anyway, I just tell myself he's at peace now and I revel at having been blessed to experience the magic of MJ during my lifetime.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Nah I dont believe it.

I know the back thing is true. But the thing about his feet I dont believe. I mean, he wasnt just in a few dance routines. He danced throughout the whole thing. Thats one thing.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Rockin. said:
Whether this post is true or not I don't know but I don't think this post is trying to be negative saying MJ was incabable in any way.. for example they said dirty diana was really good and they dnt know why it wasn't shown.



The coroners report showed arthritis in his back. Nobody is saying he's disabled or anything just his back and feet hurt after dancing. Not unusual anyway for a dancer I don't think.



It doesn't say anywhere that Michael didn't sound good...

Though I agree with you that any 'lipsyncing' didn't look obvious to me, except in maybe 2 songs.
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It says it when talking about Dirty Diana that Mj did a run through of the number but he didn't sound all that good.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

daisy said:
Thanks. Ok so it was Michael's idea to film but he forwarded all the rights to AEG.
Why would he do that? I know Frank Dileo told that Michael could not afford these equipment, maybe that's because.

Before Michael always filmed everything and I think that always belonged to him.
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Yes, previously Mj paid his own people to do his filming so quite naturally he would own and keep all of those videos.

This time apparently Mj couldn't afford it (as frank said, we don't really know) so AEG paid for the filming so they would own the rights to it.

The only thing I don't understand is if AEG paid for it, what rights did MJ have to them? Was it part of the agree that they would then hand over everything to MJ? If that is so, then wouldn't those rights transfer to his estate if he died? maybe that is why the estate had to approve of everything that was in the movie?

I dunno.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

this is fake as hell. all the info sounds like a fan whos gathered loads of info from the net, not a professional
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Rockin. said:
Whether this post is true or not I don't know but I don't think this post is trying to be negative saying MJ was incabable in any way.. for example they said dirty diana was really good and they dnt know why it wasn't shown.



The coroners report showed arthritis in his back. Nobody is saying he's disabled or anything just his back and feet hurt after dancing. Not unusual anyway for a dancer I don't think.



It doesn't say anywhere that Michael didn't sound good...

Though I agree with you that any 'lipsyncing' didn't look obvious to me, except in maybe 2 songs.
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actually, the person did say MJ didn't sound all that good. i read it in the post. and, arthritis does disable a person. MJ shouldn't have been able to move hardly at all, with arthritis. i've seen arthritis at work in people i know. i know what the coroner report said..but i have experience seeing people with arthritis. maybe upon further review, the coroner might discover something else, or, a misjudgement. after all, people are still wondering, over a hundred years later, what Mozart really died of, and there are still professional questions on that.

it seems they would have discovered the arthritis when he took his physical, or he could have claimed the arthritis and decided to not go on tour, and maybe they wouldn't have signed him up to tour.
 
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Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Rockin. said:
Though I agree with you that any 'lipsyncing' didn't look obvious to me, except in maybe 2 songs.
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Just a clarification. There wasn't any lip synching or miming in the movie. That is when you pretend you are singing but there is a recorded vocal track playing behind you. I doubt Michael lip synched during the rehearsals. It does seem like in some cases they took the vocals from one rehearsal and the video from several rehearsals, so it may appear that the vocals don't go with the video.
What definitely is in the movie is some over dubbing of some of the songs where the sound isn't good for what ever reason. That happens at the editing stage. They add in vocals to parts of the song. The songs that were overdubbed are listed in the credits.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

vncwilliam said:
actually, the person did say MJ didn't sound all that good. i read it in the post. and, arthritis does disable a person. MJ shouldn't have been able to move hardly at all, with arthritis. i've seen arthritis at work in people i know. i know what the coroner report said..but i have experience seeing people with arthritis. maybe upon further review, the coroner might discover something else, or, a misjudgement. after all, people are still wondering, over a hundred years later, what Mozart really died of, and there are still professional questions on that.

it seems they would have discovered the arthritis when he took his physical, or he could have claimed the arthritis and decided to not go on tour, and maybe they wouldn't have signed him up to tour.
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I think the autopsy said he had mild osteoarthritis. My sister works as a physical therapist and says this can be degenerative. it was funny, when he was dancing when he was younger, my sister used to say he is going to have arthritis when he gets older.

Anyway, the point I was making is that even with this, especially if it is not in an advanced stage, he would have been ok. Maybe stiff sometimes, and maybes ome pain sometimes. but the longer he would have had it, it would have taken a huge toll on his mobility.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

ginvid said:
I think the autopsy said he had mild osteoarthritis. My sister works as a physical therapist and says this can be degenerative. it was funny, when he was dancing when he was younger, my sister used to say he is going to have arthritis when he gets older.

Anyway, the point I was making is that even with this, especially if it is not in an advanced stage, he would have been ok. Maybe stiff sometimes, and maybes ome pain sometimes. but the longer he would have had it, it would have taken a huge toll on his mobility.
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however, in the case of MJ...lol..the backup dancers had trouble keeping up with him, and some of MJ's jerking movements..lightning like movements couldn't stand any form of back problem. and people have been saying he had it for more than ten years. that's why i have doubts about it, with MJ. nobody can move like MJ did in that movie, with a perfect back. but MJ did, so, that's why i have my doubts about a bad back, in any sense... regular dancer aches and pains, from a perfectly healthy person, aside.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

arthritis comes in a million varieties. mild, moderate, severe. depending on your pain tolerance, it can be disabling but does not have to be. i have patients on heavy narcotics because of arthritis while others get by with nothing or simple tylenol. the medicines Michael was on suggest that he suffered from pain. yet he moved very well in This Is It.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

vncwilliam said:
however, in the case of MJ...lol..the backup dancers had trouble keeping up with him, and some of MJ's jerking movements..lightning like movements couldn't stand any form of back problem. and people have been saying he had it for more than ten years. that's why i have doubts about it, with MJ. nobody can move like MJ did in that movie, with a perfect back. but MJ did, so, that's why i have my doubts about a bad back, in any sense... regular dancer aches and pains, from a perfectly healthy person, aside.
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do you remember how Michael walked during the trial? He said himself he had back pain. Most people develop arthritis with age.

it's not all or nothing when it comes to back problems/pain. Michael is a world class athlete who could dance for hours every day. I remember him saying he would lose 15 pounds every concert because he sweat so much. This is a man with a high pain threshold so I'm sure he just blocked out the pain on stage.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Dangerous21 said:
do you remember how Michael walked during the trial? He said himself he had back pain. Most people develop arthritis with age.

it's not all or nothing when it comes to back problems/pain. Michael is a world class athlete who could dance for hours every day. I remember him saying he would lose 15 pounds every concert because he sweat so much. This is a man with a high pain threshold so I'm sure he just blocked out the pain on stage.
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That makes sense. Someone said in another thred that when they were up and moving about they didn't feel their back pain as much but when they had to sit still, it hurt so much more. Maybe when MJ danced he could block it out more. Maybe some days he was ok and some days this was more difficult.

Thanks!
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Dangerous21 said:
do you remember how Michael walked during the trial? He said himself he had back pain. Most people develop arthritis with age.

it's not all or nothing when it comes to back problems/pain. Michael is a world class athlete who could dance for hours every day. I remember him saying he would lose 15 pounds every concert because he sweat so much. This is a man with a high pain threshold so I'm sure he just blocked out the pain on stage.
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the way he walked during the trial was because of a fall, not because of persistent back problems. so i still have my doubts. i have my doubts about some of the medicines. the ones that were suggested were supposed to be for anxiety, and depression.. we''ll just have to agree to disagree, because there is no proof either way. he twisted his ankle and was in a wheelchair for that 'remember the time' stunt in 93..so...when he had a pain problem, he sat it out.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

vncwilliam said:
the way he walked during the trial was because of a fall, not because of persistent back problems. so i still have my doubts. i have my doubts about some of the medicines. the ones that were suggested were supposed to be for anxiety, and depression.. we''ll just have to agree to disagree, because there is no proof either way. he twisted his ankle and was in a wheelchair for that 'remember the time' stunt in 93..so...when he had a pain problem, he sat it out.
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i'm just saying that Michael can have arthritis (as seen on autopsy) and not be disabled. so many people have arthritis and degenerative joint disease but you would never know unless you saw their xray. twisted ankle is different because he would not have had any stability or balance on that leg and would have hurt himself more. But even then he got up and danced a bit at the end of that performance.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Dangerous21 said:
i'm just saying that Michael can have arthritis (as seen on autopsy) and not be disabled. so many people have arthritis and degenerative joint disease but you would never know unless you saw their xray. twisted ankle is different because he would not have had any stability or balance on that leg and would have hurt himself more. But even then he got up and danced a bit at the end of that performance.
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well..eye of the beholder, apparently, because he didn't get up and dance..he stood up for a second, shouted, and sat down.

again, we have to agree to disagree. those other people that have degenerative arthritis don't have to move like Michael did. and like i said about the autopsy, they get revised, all the time. did you see how MJ moved during his performance of Human Nature in This Is It? NOOOBODY else could move their back like that...or did move their back like that, if they had any problems, whatsoever. i've never seen anybody move their back like that, period, without throwing their back out.

you just said that the way MJ walked during the trial was because of a bad back, yet you said, at the same time, that people move around with the disorders you described, as if not disabled..at the same time.
 
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Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

vncwilliam said:
well..eye of the beholder, apparently, because he didn't get up and dance..he stood up for a second, shouted, and sat down.

again, we have to agree to disagree. those other people that have degenerative arthritis don't have to move like Michael did. and like i said about the autopsy, they get revised, all the time. did you see how MJ moved during his performance of Human Nature in This Is It? NOOOBODY else could move their back like that...or did move their back like that, if they had any problems, whatsoever. i've never seen anybody move their back like that, period, without throwing their back out.
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i havn't seen that in a while so you're probably right. but my point was that despite a twisted ankle, Michael wanted to dance. He's not the type to sit around.

i don't know what your understanding of arthritis is. but speaking from a medical standpoint, someone can have arthritis AND still move flawlessly. if you watch sports, there are countless stories of players playing with broken bones, torn ligaments, etc. Dwight Freeney just did that in the superbowl. People can perform despite pain and injury.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

Dangerous21 said:
i havn't seen that in a while so you're probably right. but my point was that despite a twisted ankle, Michael wanted to dance. He's not the type to sit around.

i don't know what your understanding of arthritis is. but speaking from a medical standpoint, someone can have arthritis AND still move flawlessly. if you watch sports, there are countless stories of players playing with broken bones, torn ligaments, etc. Dwight Freeney just did that in the superbowl. People can perform despite pain and injury.
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yeah..i know people can perform despite injury...to a point. Freeney became ineffective, as the game wore on..and i saw him on the sidelines, and he was wincing..and clearly struggling.

like i said..nobody moves like Mj did. and that human nature trick shouldn't be tried by anyone...

and...as we know...doctors CAN be wrong. we found that out, the hard way.

i have seen a hundred eye doctors...and fifty of them were wrong..and one of them caused me to have a bus accident, because i listened to them..

for me personally, i'll always have my doubts about the arthritis, or osteo, with MJ..

if you don't...so be it.

yes...MJ wanted to dance..but, he was no fool. he didn't move, if something was wrong.

for me personally, everybody in my family, and friends i know with any sort of back problem, acted a little hampered, at least. so..i guess i have my view, and you have yours.
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

This is more bullcrap designed once again to make Michael look bad, even after he is dead.......

Exactly, how do you get sued by AEG when:
1.) AEG don't own the footage anymore, they sold it to Sony!
2.)There;s something called Free-Speech in the World, I bet even the tabloids ignored this idiot because even they won't believe him.

Nobody in the Universe can move like Michael.........we MJ fans can vouch for that. Almost all of us fans could spot a phoney MJ, I'm not sure how 90% failed to do.

Who cares about the vocals, it's still Michael from the rehearsal isn't it. You have to remember that the cameras used were only meant for private use, so that usually means that they didn't use the usual studio heavy duty microphones and it was just standard camera microphone used to record the sound. If that's the case, then I guess the director just used the audio recorded from the sound systems (not the camera) and just did some editing with the camera sound (which includes background noise, talking. etc.). This means that it's still a legit Michael voice, just from a different source.



And Finally, why are there so many people so sure that Michael wanted to kill himself. If he knew he couldn't do it, he wouldn't do it!!!!.......He's not an idiot you know!!!!
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

vncwilliam said:
again, we have to agree to disagree. those other people that have degenerative arthritis don't have to move like Michael did. and like i said about the autopsy, they get revised, all the time. did you see how MJ moved during his performance of Human Nature in This Is It? NOOOBODY else could move their back like that...or did move their back like that, if they had any problems, whatsoever. i've never seen anybody move their back like that, period, without throwing their back out.
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I am a few years younger than Michael and have arthritis in my neck. Not severe. I can move my neck ok but it hurts. If it flares up I can't turn my head. And I have a fairly mild case.

As far as Michael. No one else could ever move like him. People try but they never quite get it right. I thought when I saw This Is It that he seemed more fluid and flexible than I had ever seen him. Elvish, almost. He wasn't doing some of the more jarring stuff. But, more elegant, more refined motion, but equally impressive. It didn't seem like his back was bothering him a lot. But, despite what some people say, I think he had a fairly high tolerance for pain. He has had broken bones and kept on performing. And when he got burned, he didn't scream or yell or anything. There are other instances as well. Probably he learned to buck up and deal with pain as a child......
 
Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

MJ said in one of the interviews that whenever the music started playing, you couldn't tie him down. He had to move. He couldn't help but dance. Even with arthritis and inflamed lungs, he had to move when he heard music. You saw him in the film say "I'm not gonna go full out here" but you can tell he's getting so into the moment that he just does it, then afterwards he says "I shouldn't be singing out, I'm trying to warm up my voice for this moment". He couldn't help himself. It just happens when he hears the music. It's like the music takes over his body, and Michael Jackson the man, turns into Michael Jackson the performer, and then after the song's over, Michael Jackson the man realises that Michael Jackson the performer has just gone and sung full out when Michael Jackson the man knows he shouldn't be singing full out.

It's the same with dancing. Michael Jackson the man could say, "well my back is killing me, I'm tired, I'm not going to go crazy dancing today". Fine. Up on the stage, music starts and BAM! Michael Jackson the performer is back. Popping and locking, side glides, running around, kicking his legs up in the air... Michael Jackson the man comes back to his body and says "I thought I told myself I wasn't going to dance. What was that?! What WAS THAT?!" Sorry to be so confusing lol, but that's just how I have always seen it. Michael Jackson the man can say he's going to hold back, he can say he's in pain, he can say he's not going to sing full out, but Michael Jackson the performer doesn't care. Michael Jackson the performer is going to do what he wants and Michael Jackson the man is going to have to deal with it. You've heard people say Michael was a different person on stage? It's the truth.

Even though Michael was in pain, and I'm fairly sure he was, when he was on stage, something came over him. None of it mattered anymore. It's after the show is over, and Michael Jackson the man lands back in his body, that's when he'd feel it. That's when he'd say "I shouldn't have done that. Now I'm in pain". And he'd say to himself, "Next time, I'm going to take it easy". Gets back on that stage, and does the same thing as before. He couldn't help it. It just happened. He naturally moved to music. It was instinctive.

Arthritis or not, once Michael got on that stage, you couldn't stop him. I know it doesn't make any logical sense. I know what you're saying, technically, with arthritis in his back, he shouldn't be able to move like that. The coroner must be wrong. He probably did have arthritis, but like I said before, he couldn't help but move when he heard music. It just happened.

Whenever I was little, any music would start, they couldn’t sit me down. They couldn’t tie me down actually. Even to this day, if anyone played a beat, I’ll start kicking in and making counter rhythms to the beat that I’m hearing. It’s just a natural instinct.
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^ Straight from the horse's mouth.
 
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Re: A message from one of Michael's techs on TII

StephluvsMJ said:
MJ said in one of the interviews that whenever the music started playing, you couldn't tie him down. He had to move. He couldn't help but dance. Even with arthritis and inflamed lungs, he had to move when he heard music. You saw him in the film say "I'm not gonna go full out here" but you can tell he's getting so into the moment that he just does it, then afterwards he says "I shouldn't be singing out, I'm trying to warm up my voice for this moment". He couldn't help himself. It just happens when he hears the music. It's like the music takes over his body, and Michael Jackson the man, turns into Michael Jackson the performer, and then after the song's over, Michael Jackson the man realises that Michael Jackson the performer has just gone and sung full out when Michael Jackson the man knows he shouldn't be singing full out.

It's the same with dancing. Michael Jackson the man could say, "well my back is killing me, I'm tired, I'm not going to go crazy dancing today". Fine. Up on the stage, music starts and BAM! Michael Jackson the performer is back. Popping and locking, side glides, running around, kicking his legs up in the air... Michael Jackson the man comes back to his body and says "I thought I told myself I wasn't going to dance. What was that?! What WAS THAT?!" Sorry to be so confusing lol, but that's just how I have always seen it. Michael Jackson the man can say he's going to hold back, he can say he's in pain, he can say he's not going to sing full out, but Michael Jackson the performer doesn't care. Michael Jackson the performer is going to do what he wants and Michael Jackson the man is going to have to deal with it. You've heard people say Michael was a different person on stage? It's the truth.

Even though Michael was in pain, and I'm fairly sure he was, when he was on stage, something came over him. None of it mattered anymore. It's after the show is over, and Michael Jackson the man lands back in his body, that's when he'd feel it. That's when he'd say "I shouldn't have done that. Now I'm in pain". And he'd say to himself, "Next time, I'm going to take it easy". Gets back on that stage, and does the same thing as before. He couldn't help it. It just happened. He naturally moved to music. It was instinctive.

Arthritis or not, once Michael got on that stage, you couldn't stop him. I know it doesn't make any logical sense. I know what you're saying, technically, with arthritis in his back, he shouldn't be able to move like that. The coroner must be wrong. He probably did have arthritis, but like I said before, he couldn't help but move when he heard music. It just happened.



^ Straight from the horse's mouth.
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exactly. and even technically, he can - and did - move like that with arthritis. arthritis isn't paralyzing.

love the Man vs Performer thing too! a comic of MJ would be sweet. can you draw?

or at least go on a bit more with their convo...

Michael the Man could have the soft voice...Performer Mike would be "dirty diannaa naaa" haha
 
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