Original Pic Used To Fake MJ Ambulance Pic

[Dangerous Incorporated]

Hi DI

Look I'm not getting into an argument, I'm just putting across the other side of the story, I don't want fans on this site to think they're being messed about with these crazy hoax tales, the pictures are there to prove they are not fakes. Until someone shows me someone elses face on that ambulance stretcher to prove that it's not Michael Jackson, then I'll agree with you that they are fake photos.

Regards
DJ

You clearly didnt read my post you quoted. I said it was about money. I did not mention a hoax. You mentioned a hoax lol

 

[MJJ7777]

Ok, I couldn't find the discussion about the dates (24th June, 12:08 Jun 25th, etc.,)through the archives (of the old forum that went down) as it is very time consuming but I did find the camera details of the ambulance picture which shows the 12:08 timing on another forum, nothing new.

http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxdeath.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1497&start=10

Headline: Michael Jackson Rushed to Hospital in Ambulance
Creator: National Photo Group
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Lens: 24 mm
(Max aperture f/3.5)
Exposure: Auto exposure, Shutter priority AE, 1/250 sec, f/4.5, ISO 400
Date: June 25, 2009 12:08:08PM (timezone is GMT - 7 hours)
(6 months, 9 days, 1 hour, 10 minutes, 54 seconds ago)

Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA
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Images for the web are most widly viewable when in the sRGB color space and with an embedded color profile. See my Introduction to Digital-Image Color Spaces for more information.

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Date/Time Original 2009:06:25 12:08:08-07:00
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2. And this site features a short description of the details: http://mjkit.forumotion.net/pictures-hoax-f11/the-2-june-25th-ambulance-photos-t3312.htm

NIKON
CORPORATION

NIKON D200

2009-06-25T23:31:53Z(last time
modified on PC, likely before start of paper printing)

Adobe Fireworks
CS3



2009-06-25T16:22:43-07:00
(put on PC)




2009-06-25T16:22:43-07:00



2009-06-25T12:08:08-07:00(taken
with camera at camera time)



2009-06-25T12:08:08-07:00




If
time in the camera was set correctly (which is usually the case for
professional photographs),

The picture was taken 12:08

They called 911 at 12:21 [URL="http://x17online.com/celebriti"]http://x17online.com/celebriti…..042009.php[/URL]

And the paramedics arrived at 12:26 (source [URL="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/"]http://www.telegraph.co.uk[/URL])

There is a time difference from 12:08 untill 12:26

That's 18 minutes before the paramedics arrive.


the
original link to the pic is this:


http://www.etonline.com/media/…..090625.jpg

 

[Dangerous Incorporated]

This pic of the screen of Engine 71 was taken the same day supposedly. Can you check daisy with EXIF what info this has? Im not sure if this is one of the originals or not. There are 2 pics. One of a screenshot from a video and one is a photo:

http://www.arlingtoncardinal.com/20...lafd-paramedic-rescue-call-cpr-for-50-yo-man/

 

[callmerose]

Well didn't someone say that somebody compared and Mike's face is in the exact same spot in all three pics? If they were taken from slightly different angles then the face would move/look different as well.
Just bc they are 3 different ones doesn't mean the face couldn't have been photoshopped over 3 times. And that would explain why his nose looks different.

Dunno.

Good point Angel. If the angle changed enough as the ambulance moved away to reveal more of the emts hand, then there should have been at least some small change in the angle of Michael's face. I can't see any change at all in those 3 pictures.

 

[Dangerous Incorporated]

Good point Angel. If the angle changed enough as the ambulance moved away to reveal more of the emts hand, then there should have been at least some small change in the angle of Michael's face. I can't see any change at all in those 3 pictures.

lol Cool excellent point. So you proved DJSTS wrong by their own example! l:tease:

 

[diana79]

Good point Angel. If the angle changed enough as the ambulance moved away to reveal more of the emts hand, then there should have been at least some small change in the angle of Michael's face. I can't see any change at all in those 3 pictures.

I thought that the EMT's hand was moving, not the ambulance. Also, these pictures/video stills must have been taken very, very quickly, so I didn't think that the very slow movement of the ambulance affected the angle of their shots much.

After some thought, one thing that I don't understand is that these photos were supposedly taken with two devices - a camera and a video camera. But, the angle of all the photos I've seen so far is basically the same. The only difference that I see is that the EMT's hand and arm move. Were the two photographers holding their cameras at the same height and angle?

Also, where is that first photo in this thread from, the one with the blurred face? You can see the entire window behind the standing EMT in that one. The sitting EMT's arm doesn't block it at all. I haven't seen it anywhere else.

 

[earth child]

Hi guys, I must be the only one on here that truly believes the image is not a fake. We seem to be clutching at straws, wth what image was used to fake this ambulance picture.

If you all believe that the image is fake, then why was there three photo's released by the same photographer. Please explain the below three images, they are not just a cropped image of the same photo.

Please explain these guys:

This pic shows only three fingers

This pic shows four fingers

This pic shows the complete hand. But!!! what the hell is that a silhouette / outline of Michael's face (green box), very weird?

Do you really think the faker decided to make three versions of the same image, the three shots were taken with the same camera with probably half a second in between each shot as the ambulance drove off.

You can actually see this on the below video from Youtube, the guy in the red t-shirt gets the shots, plus at the start of the video you can make out the red car that appears in the photo reflection.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yx8KrGIQ5mg

Personally the photo's are real, why after such a long time are we now thinking that these are fakes, someone's pulling your leg, on this forum, not naming any names 'Dangerous...'

You have yet to explain the time stamps being at 12:08 when the ambulance wasn't even called until 12:21.

That could be any three sequential shots with MJ's face added in. The angel of his face never changes.

 

[earth child]

This pic of the screen of Engine 71 was taken the same day supposedly. Can you check daisy with EXIF what info this has? Im not sure if this is one of the originals or not. There are 2 pics. One of a screenshot from a video and one is a photo:

http://www.arlingtoncardinal.com/20...lafd-paramedic-rescue-call-cpr-for-50-yo-man/

So the time says 12:22, and weren't that at the house for and hour, working on MJ before they ever loaded him?
With the face angel never changing and the time stamp not explained, I say they are fake.

 

[Dangerous Incorporated]

So the time says 12:22, and weren't that at the house for and hour, working on MJ before they ever loaded him?
With the face angel never changing and the time stamp not explained, I say they are fake.

Well 12:21 is when 911 was called so the Fire Engine 71 couldnt have been there within 1 min. So this image is fake also. So if 1 image from Ben is fake, why wouldnt I think the 2nd isnt?

 

[Angel]

Well are we sure the photo of the screen is the actual screen from inside the ambulance? Bc I always assumed it would be the screen from the 911 headquarters when the person received the call.
It's way too clear and if they barely had time to take the alleged photo then I don't think they could have taken the screen as well.

 

[Dangerous Incorporated]

^^Why would they take a pic of that? They wouldnt even know it was Michael cuz his name wasnt mentioned.

 

[Angel]

They did know after they brought him to the hospital. That's how they found the recording as well. I'm sure they have records of all the calls and info in a database. It would be easy to go back and search.

Oh, unless someone can get the exif data on that pic too and see when exactly it was taken. But I' pretty sure it was taken after 25th.

 

[MattyJam]

How about the fact that the angle of the picture is side on?? It almost looks as if the picture is taken from inside the ambulance. If you took a picture from the outside of the ambulance (which is where the paparazzi photographer was) there is no way MJ would be positioned like that. You would either get the top of his head or the bottom of his feet. You wouldn't get a picture perfect side shot.

 

[daisy]

MJ7777 thanks! well, we cannot still see from the data whether the pic was photomontaged, but maybe that's something thats not available, so that' why everybody sticks to the time discrepancy thing.

They did know after they brought him to the hospital. That's how they found the recording as well. I'm sure they have records of all the calls and info in a database. It would be easy to go back and search.

Oh, unless someone can get the exif data on that pic too and see when exactly it was taken. But I' pretty sure it was taken after 25th.

Unfortunately, exif data are unavailable form that picture on this site
http://www.arlingtoncardinal.com/20...lafd-paramedic-rescue-call-cpr-for-50-yo-man/

 

[triniti]

I suppose, that if the fake photos had been edited for hoax purpose, it would has been only one photo perfectly made. Why so much troubles with three photos? If everything had been prepared earlier, they would have arranged the scene in such way that any doubts could not have been raised.
Discrepancy of time is strange. The magazine's editors must have noticed this small detail. In my opinion the circumstantces the photo had been taken under, should be evidence of validity of it. Was wrong time sat intentionally? Why? And why we still are able to get exif data with wrong information?

Too many questions

 

[triniti]

and suddenly it appears, there were two photographers. I was convincend, that only Ben was the one, who had taken photo. They couldn't take two photos in the same moment similar to such extend. This is simply impossible. They were taken from the same angle.

I think that Ben was the only person who could do it. Do We know the personality of the second photographer?

 

[daisydaisy]

No, I think the picture that we see from 2001 isn't the one they used.

I think this is the picture. (Top is comparison, bottom is an overlay)

Everything is the same except for the hair and clothes, which is easily photoshopped (if they only pasted the face).

I haven't seen any proposed picture match as well as this. Literally everything on this fits perfectly.

Thanks for finding this picture. It is a good match, but it's not an exact match to me.

The gap between his left sideburn and ear is bigger in the old picture; on the 'ambulance picture' the gap is not there.

The left eyebrows look very similar but the 'ambulance picture' one has a slightly different shape and appears thinner towards the outside edge.

The nose looks different on both pics.

It is possible they 'tweaked' all these things, but not sure if they could have made his skin tone realistically darker by photoshop?

 

[Shamone85]

this picture has exif data

http://x17online.com/celebrities/mi..._on_the_day_michael_jackson_died-07042009.php

Filename : MJacksonComputerTranscript_04-full.jpg
Comment : AppleMark

JFIF_APP14 : Photoshop 3.0
JFIF_APP2 : ICC Profile (offset:4357 size:1359bytes)
AdobeResource
IPTC-NAA : 4000Byte
DisplayInfo : 16Byte
PrintFlags : 8Byte
Print flags : 10Byte
Color halftoning information : 72Byte
Color transfer functions : 112Byte
IPTC
Record version : 0002
Title : Michael Jackson
Photographer : Arturo/X17online.com
Place of dispatch : Beverly Hills
Subtitle : Michael Jackson's ambulance screen EXCLUSIVE
Credit : Arturo/X17online.com
Copyright Info : Arturo/X17online.com
Caption : Michael Jackson's ambulance computer screen showing that Michael was not breathing at all an hour before he arrived at the hospital June 25, 2009 /X17online.com EXCLUSIVE
Unknown (183) : CP_2
Unknown (232) : Model: DiMAGE X1
Camera Date: 2009:06:25 11:24:33
ISO: 80
Aperture: 3.8
Exposure Time: 1/40
Focal length: 23.1 mm
Flash: Auto, Did not fire
Exposure program: Program AE
Unknown (240) :
Error

 

[Em_Mj]

 

[Samtkaninchen]

Thanks for finding this picture. It is a good match, but it's not an exact match to me.

The gap between his left sideburn and ear is bigger in the old picture; on the 'ambulance picture' the gap is not there.

The left eyebrows look very similar but the 'ambulance picture' one has a slightly different shape and appears thinner towards the outside edge.

The nose looks different on both pics.

It is possible they 'tweaked' all these things, but not sure if they could have made his skin tone realistically darker by photoshop?

In photoshop you can change nearly everything. The skin tone of the face needs to be adjusted to match the body. The posted non-ambulance picture is not that clear so contrasts are missing. But I am sure there is a sharp version of this picture, and then the nose is the same. If you insert a picture part to another pic sometimes you need to "adjust" it to make it fit, perhaps stretch it in a fraction of a millimeter. And when deleting details like some hair - as they would look unreal with someone lying on the back - you easily might touch a part of a brow.

To me the pics are matching.

 

[diana79]

The paps were not anywhere near Michael on Monday, Tue and Wed. They just showed up unexpectedly on that Th morning. It was a bit weird.

IMO, this is one of the most important things that I found in this thread. Why did they suddenly show up on Thursday morning?

 

[Shamone85]

and suddenly it appears, there were two photographers. I was convincend, that only Ben was the one, who had taken photo. They couldn't take two photos in the same moment similar to such extend. This is simply impossible. They were taken from the same angle.

I think that Ben was the only person who could do it. Do We know the personality of the second photographer?

there were also Christopher Weiss and Alfred Ibanez
http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2009/07/michael-jackson-photo200907

 

[diana79]

and suddenly it appears, there were two photographers. I was convincend, that only Ben was the one, who had taken photo. They couldn't take two photos in the same moment similar to such extend. This is simply impossible. They were taken from the same angle.

I think that Ben was the only person who could do it. Do We know the personality of the second photographer?

The second photographer was Chris Weiss (I think?), and he works for Ben. I think Ben was just lying about their story, probably to try to make the photos more valuable.

 

[DJ Spins the sounds]

there were also Christopher Weiss and Alfred Ibanez
http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2009/07/michael-jackson-photo200907

I've counted upto five photographers from various youtube videos, you'll see 3 photographers at the back and two photographers at the side of the ambulance (where these photo's have come from).

 

[daisy]

IMO, this is one of the most important things that I found in this thread. Why did they suddenly show up on Thursday morning?

Yes, this is a very important question, I have also asked it -
Cris123, Were they there even BEFORE the ambulance was even called???

Camera Date: 2009:06:25 11:24:33

Is that the time taking the pic with the screen???

 

[triniti]

there were also Christopher Weiss and Alfred Ibanez
http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2009/07/michael-jackson-photo200907

thank you, very interesting article

 

[DJ Spins the sounds]

this picture has exif data

http://x17online.com/celebrities/mi..._on_the_day_michael_jackson_died-07042009.php

Filename : MJacksonComputerTranscript_04-full.jpg
Comment : AppleMark

JFIF_APP14 : Photoshop 3.0
JFIF_APP2 : ICC Profile (offset:4357 size:1359bytes)
AdobeResource
IPTC-NAA : 4000Byte
DisplayInfo : 16Byte
PrintFlags : 8Byte
Print flags : 10Byte
Color halftoning information : 72Byte
Color transfer functions : 112Byte
IPTC
Record version : 0002
Title : Michael Jackson
Photographer : Arturo/X17online.com
Place of dispatch : Beverly Hills
Subtitle : Michael Jackson's ambulance screen EXCLUSIVE
Credit : Arturo/X17online.com
Copyright Info : Arturo/X17online.com
Caption : Michael Jackson's ambulance computer screen showing that Michael was not breathing at all an hour before he arrived at the hospital June 25, 2009 /X17online.com EXCLUSIVE
Unknown (183) : CP_2
Unknown (232) : Model: DiMAGE X1
Camera Date: 2009:06:25 11:24:33
ISO: 80
Aperture: 3.8
Exposure Time: 1/40
Focal length: 23.1 mm
Flash: Auto, Did not fire
Exposure program: Program AE
Unknown (240) :
Error

There's a simple explanation for these discrepancies in time difference between eixf data on these photo's. The camera's are set an hour behind LA time, simply as that, the amount of time zones throughout USA could be why these camera's are reading incorrectly. Look at the examples, ie the one above camera time reads 11.24 should read 12.24, and the other shots of the ambulance read at 12.08 which should read 1.08.

Hopefully this now put's all doubt's that these photo's were never faked, they are all 100% real.

 

[DJ Spins the sounds]

IMO, this is one of the most important things that I found in this thread. Why did they suddenly show up on Thursday morning?

They all showed up because most of the pappa are connected to any emergency calls made in LA, you don't see any photo's or video of the ambulance arriving do you? By the time they got to the house the ambulance was already there or just leaving.

 

[diana79]

there were also Christopher Weiss and Alfred Ibanez
http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2009/07/michael-jackson-photo200907

Thanks for the article! I wonder if any of the fans that were there that day can confirm the details (Ibanez was there first alone, the ambulance arrived, and then Ben and Chris showed up).

So, Ibanez got the picture of the screen in the fire truck. It seems that his camera was off by about an hour, then, since the screen says 12:22 and the data says 11:24. Chris or Ben's camera was off by at least 18 minutes. Maybe these guys just don't keep their camera times accurate.

 

[diana79]

They all showed up because most of the pappa are connected to any emergency calls made in LA, you don't see any photo's or video of the ambulance arriving do you? By the time they got to the house the ambulance was already there or just leaving.

Cris123 mentioned that she thought it was a bit weird that the paps showed up that morning. Why would she think it's weird if they showed up after the ambulance arrived?